REALLY advanced sky system...possible?

Posted By: exile

REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/13/06 18:13

I am wondering if an extremely detailed and advanced sky system is possible in 3dgs. Here are some things I hope to achieve.

1. REAL beams of light coming through the clouds
2. The clouds cast a real shadow
3. The clouds actually change shape and formation
4. When the player walks from a light area to a dark area, the screen gets bright for a second so their "eyes" can adjust.
5. The "thinner" sections of the clouds are brighter than the "thicker" parts
6. REAL sunlight where if you stare into the sun then the screen gets bright.

I got these ideas while paying attention to the sky system in Enchanted Arms. I am wondering if this is possible in 3DGS. I have included a picture of what I am hopefully trying to achieve. Pay close attention to the details.


Posted By: Tiinusen

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/13/06 18:24

Hmm i dosent really know but the idea sounds good.
Posted By: broozar

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/14/06 08:30

1. what's meant with "real"? realtime? real spot light?
2. would be nice, but a slowdown...
3. try ello's sky system 2 (earthcontrol.de)
4,5,6 are HDR features, try the bloom shader provided in matt's shader collection. it's not hdr, sure, but it comes close.
Posted By: JibbSmart

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/14/06 08:49

yeh DaBro0zar's right about the HDR and ello's sky system. well, 5 would also in part be part of the sky system (having grey on thicker parts, etc, but probably not too hard with ello's). beams of light through the clouds? most likely they'd all be faked with models, particle effects or something. serious sam 1 and 2 do that.

clouds cast real shadows: that is simply a projected shadow system, probably tiled or procedural based on the clouds also being made. doesn't hav to be high-res coz u'd smooth it out anyway.

julz
Posted By: Sebe

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/14/06 09:29

Nearly all of the sky features that you want are nothing else than HDR, High Dynamic Range Rendering. 3dgs doesn't have that yet, but it was included in a Beta of Sphere [sadly it isn't available anymore in the final version -.- it looked really good to me] That means, it's possible, just someone has to make it.
And about the shadows, that are just tiled projected textures, moving. Has nothing to do with real shadows
Posted By: ello

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/14/06 10:33

well, just thought to show two screens using skySystem2 and sylex for the bloom:



if you can programm a dll you can create things like this:
http://www.gamedev.net/community/forums/topic.asp?topic_id=86024


Posted By: broozar

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/14/06 10:38

the last pic (not yours, the one from the other forum) looks so very much like terraGen... even the pixellation of the clouds fits.
Posted By: ello

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/14/06 11:32

Quote:

the last pic (not yours, the one from the other forum) looks so very much like terraGen... even the pixellation of the clouds fits.




yes, but its realtime as mentioned in the thread and wow, i'd love to know the sourcecode;)
Posted By: exile

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/14/06 21:06

Wow thanks guys for the quick replys. I will definately look into making a dll for 3DGS to make skys like this. Also, I havent been on the Ask Conitec boards yet, but do you guys know if 3DGS has any plans to support HDR?
Posted By: Matt_Aufderheide

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/24/06 22:23

Doing an HDR dll would be very very easy.. I had it in Sphere once.. got rid of it because frankly I thin HDR is kind of not so great..
Posted By: TheStonerunner

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/25/06 05:29

Care to put that back in? :-) Or at least release that version along with the final one? I'm not sure I'd really use it, but it'd be nice to have.
Posted By: Why_Do_I_Die

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/25/06 09:50

what does anyone need such an advanced sky system for ? Who is looking at the sky while playing their games ? Most people wont even notice any of the sky effects , and if they do , they'll just say , thats pretty koo , and never pay attention to it again . LOL , Why waste so much time and effort implementing a system no one is gone care about ?

Btw , all that stuff can be done with models , sprites , and scripting , but it seems like a lot of work for what it is , A good skycube is good enough IMO.
Posted By: Bahamut

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/18/07 16:31

Umm, i am interested in this, is someone coding a DLL for the HDR?

Those screens from SkySystem2 up there doesn't really look good IMO.
It may be the textures... i don't know
Posted By: Nems

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/19/07 01:03

Exile, you can achieve all that you want with common elements like sprites, textures and scripting (dont have a demo level anymore..)with sunbeams/clouds as alpha sprites in conjunction with a good sprite managment system fading and opaquing on demand (seriose sam comes to mind here)and flare scripting for the direct to sun effects etc.
Posted By: Felixsg

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/19/07 09:37

in Enchanted Arms have that effects?
Not in xbox360?
only in ps3?

the sky I see in xbox360 is can be possible in gamestudio
The xbox360 is a **** when I can, I sold
Posted By: Bahamut

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/21/07 10:19

I dont know about Xbox360 but people say it is very good, but i played PS3 and i am impressed sometimes! hehe (there are good games but there are bad games too)

And does someone know where can i find a tutorial for a very very good skysistem like Nemisis says? I think gamestudio is very powerfull if you know how to code.

I wish i could export games to console like in torque
Posted By: ello

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/21/07 13:51

google is you friend here:

http://www.markmark.net/PDFs/RTCloudsForGames_HarrisGDC2002.pdf
http://www.vterrain.org/Atmosphere/Clouds/
Posted By: rvL_eXile

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/21/07 16:35

I think this is a Very Interesting Video for "How to make Volumetric Clouds"

http://www.ofb.net/~eggplant/clouds/CloudsInGames_NinianeWang.mpg

cYa Sebastian
Posted By: ello

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 09/21/07 16:56

i hope someone proves me wrong, but i dont think 3dgs is capable of that (so damn nice thing)! at least not at acceptable framerates
Posted By: Matt_Aufderheide

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 10/03/07 21:07

Quote:

what does anyone need such an advanced sky system for ? Who is looking at the sky while playing their games ? Most people wont even notice any of the sky effects , and if they do , they'll just say , thats pretty koo , and never pay attention to it again . LOL , Why waste so much time and effort implementing a system no one is gone care about ?

Btw , all that stuff can be done with models , sprites , and scripting , but it seems like a lot of work for what it is , A good skycube is good enough IMO.




This is an ignorant and pointless comment... Its very easy to notice that a sky cube is just a static texture on a box.. realistic skies need to be dynamic, unless you assume there is no wind, no time of day, and that weather never changes. This was fine in Doom, but not anymore for most games of any complexity.

Clouds and so on are not flat, they are three dimensional like everything else...

So, for a realistic sky system, one should have methods to create dynamic clouds or different types, like cirrus and cumulus. There should be an atmospheric lighting system as well. One should be able to change the weather and time of day at will.
Posted By: JibbSmart

Re: REALLY advanced sky system...possible? - 10/04/07 03:23

if anyone here has played Warhawk on PS3 they'd know matt's right. the clouds are ridiculously well-done volumetric clouds which the players can fly-through and hide in (at least somewhat; the markers above players in team-death-match make it still hard not to attract attention).

placing an aerial-mine in a cloud, for example, is a great way to conceal it.

also, when using the tow-missile, a cloud is a fairly well-hidden hiding spot.

nice clouds:


julz
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