Understanding node-less AI for prototyping

Posted By: Nems

Understanding node-less AI for prototyping - 12/22/07 21:25

Well like many, scripting is basically my weakest point and now, having been at it for over 4 years, graphics, my strongest point, is suffering so I need to advance my learning curve and get a few things working at a basic level for me.

AI is critical! period.

Nodeless AI can give lots of good looking behavior routines from obstacle avoidance to hieght adjusting for both ground and air based AI and we can always get a bot to zero in on player thru vec_dist or scan functions then get it to 'hunt' down the player or avoid as needed but most require a lot of trials before the routine is found so all in all, the real problem with AI in GStudio is using routines to work with model terrains and levels (where the default block geometry provides both walls and content to work with) but models only can be accessed thru trace, dist and texture names I have found.

Nodeless AI is good to use in water pools, large rooms or confined outdoor areas where pathfinding is not an issue and adds a great deal to the believability of the game.

So what I am proposing here is a listed methadology from experienced users who know how to handle these issues and provide a layout of the methods employed to overcome common AI nodeless issues in both block and entity levels either as working or theory discussions.

Posted By: Damocles

Re: Understanding node-less AI for prototyping - 12/22/07 23:45

To hunt down the player you can create "nodes" o the fly,
that store past positions of the player. These nodes can be used for an AI to trace and follow the
payers path, when he tries to escape.

You dont always need to implement a pathfinding, if you keep the levels and abilities of the AI (regarding pathfinding) simple.

But simply: the more effort you put into AI, the more interesting the enemies will get.

Posted By: Gumby22don

Re: Understanding node-less AI for prototyping - 12/23/07 03:57

Quote:

So what I am proposing here is a listed methadology from experienced users who know how to handle these issues and provide a layout of the methods employed to overcome common AI nodeless issues in both block and entity levels either as working or theory discussions.

I really think this is a good idea, and will contribute as I work it through myself - Coincidentally, I like to think AI is my strongpoint and graphics my weakpoint.

I'd also say nodeless handling is great for client-side handling of movement, if nodes of a server-side pathfinding are passed to the clients, and they then move on each client with flocking/ avoidance/ etc. strategies, to get a reasonable intelligence, and keep them "following" where the server says they should be. (standard lag/ prediction plus flocking/ avoidance)

If anyone has "standard" avoidance movement to place here as a start, I'll experiment and put my own contributions on top of it. I'm currently still working the server side, with automatic node construction and a-star pathfinding returning a list of nodes or points to get close to on the way. I'm not looking to steal someone's code either, but I think this discussion could be great for those looking to start prototyping in 3dgs without the 3 months background work on basic movements. (say 2 weeks running through our expert's opinions and samples to get a rough prototype that can then be re-written to suit their own plans once the graphics/ models and levels are coming together)

Don
have a great day

Posted By: JazzDude

Re: Understanding node-less AI for prototyping - 12/23/07 17:37

Raiden has offered avoidance code that may be helpful in this thread:

web page

Posted By: Nems

Re: Understanding node-less AI for prototyping - 12/29/07 23:56

Yes, Raiden posted a beauty but I havnt had the time to work with it though.

Here is a link to an old project I havnt updated or revisited but adequatly describes the node less AI I have derived or edited from Georges AUM series and other contributors. (7 mgbs)

It doesnt work as well published as it does in dev mode.

The test also incorporates Leonardo's bone anims and dust too I think as well as a number of other scripts from various users.

You will find yourself probably jiggaling around, just use wasd to move, w + r to speed up, mouse left to fire cannon, mouse middle to fire homer and observe the behavior of both the air and ground based AI from both a passive and active perspective.
Use the 'radar' to locate prey when closer, drive staright ahead almost to find them.
Firing the cannon will help to orient you to the AI direction.

All scripts are available.

The AI is from a direct contribution by a contributor whom I have forgotten but is either tuscharten, turrican or Domacales, I will get it right eventually and give proper credits as soon as I am able to.

Hope this helps to extend the discussion.

Posted By: Nems

Re: Understanding node-less AI for prototyping - 12/31/07 19:09

Anyone tested out the above linked demo?
Need more thoughts on the subject if theres any to be found.

Posted By: Nomad

Re: Understanding node-less AI for prototyping - 01/03/08 22:59

Thanks for the link but I am too new to comment deeply.
From what I saw it all shows rather believable AI but the flyers are too locked into circling around, how would you work it so that AI only cirlces 2 times at most?

Posted By: Nems

Re: Understanding node-less AI for prototyping - 01/05/08 19:06

The circling around can be tweaked by editing its pan and period to hang around player untill a shot opens up.
Its all litle steps as shown in AUM series node-less AI, which need to be tweaked and tested untill it work rights.

Have removed the link as lots of downloads are happening but no replies (bad for my server bandwidth) so if any want to see it, I'll PM the new link.

Posted By: Nems

Re: Understanding node-less AI for prototyping - 02/16/08 04:55

Link back up now

Posted By: xXxGuitar511

Re: Understanding node-less AI for prototyping - 02/29/08 20:54

Well, you could always help me with my new AI project. Using Fixed Effectiveness Projection & conditional probability. It's a longshot, but eventually will turn out well...

but aside from that, you could always use a very basic AI:

Code:


if (player visible)
{
    if (player close)
    {
        attack;
    }
    else
    {
        run towards player;
         - avoid obstacles;
    }
}
else
{
    if (I am where player was last seen)
    {
        if (player visible)
        {
            continue chasing
        }
        else
        {
            error("[censored]...");
        }
    }
    else
    {
        .go to where I last saw him/her
    }
}

I found this code to work generally well, along with some simple obstacle avoidance (such as Raiden has provided)

Posted By: Nems

Re: Understanding node-less AI for prototyping - 02/29/08 21:18

Quote:

else
{
error("[censored]...");
}

Doubt if I could help but I will be revisiting this as I am currently UV mapping and animating a character to use node less AI in project Abandoned in conjunction with node based.

Still, would love to help if its within my abilities

so fire away.