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Re: Why do people::.?
[Re: indiGLOW]
#66976
03/18/06 17:06
03/18/06 17:06
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 2,234 Wisconsin USA
FoxHound
Expert
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Expert
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 2,234
Wisconsin USA
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Agreed. Several games have been made with 3dgs.
Maybe you can complain 3dgs isnt' wroth the money, that's fair, but most of them try to compare it to doom 3. and until 3dgs cost in the 1/2millon+ range, they are just showing how stupid they are.
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Re: Why do people::.?
[Re: ISG]
#66978
03/18/06 17:49
03/18/06 17:49
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 2,234 Wisconsin USA
FoxHound
Expert
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Expert
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 2,234
Wisconsin USA
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Agreeing with me is always a good thing to do.
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Re: Why do people::.?
[Re: FoxHound]
#66979
03/18/06 21:22
03/18/06 21:22
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,550 United Kingdom
indiGLOW
Serious User
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Serious User
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,550
United Kingdom
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Quote:
Agreeing with me is always a good thing to do.
Unless its agreeing to wait for the latest version of certain web related files Mr.Foxy keeps threatening to send you
One thing that has been mentioned in many other posts, and frankly can not be mentioned enough, is having design documents. If you don't plan out your project properly, yes many hours of writing, plotting and planning, schedules, assignments, outsourcing, inhouse developments, ....and basically if you don't have one BEFORE you start making your title, then your not serious about your project, so why be suprised when you fail? However it's mucher easier to say F$£$ING GS! is [insert obsenity here], that it was too much like hard work!
That said there are good arguments about the validity of GS as a AAA game engine and I suspect this debate will rage for some time yet.
Personally I think GS is a very, very good set of game development tools, its competativly priced and has a generally helpful community behind it. Make of that what you will
The Art of Conversation is dead : Discuss
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Re: Why do [censored]::.?
[Re: Alberto]
#66980
03/19/06 03:54
03/19/06 03:54
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 6,818 Minot, North Dakota, USA
ulillillia
Senior Expert
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Senior Expert
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 6,818
Minot, North Dakota, USA
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Quote:
Hello
I have been using 3dgs for about 3 monthes and I am happy about it However going through some forum I have been surprised to read some very bad reviews Ok up to a certain extent it is a matter of opinion But how can some people claim that it is impossible ( not hard , impossible) to create a real game using 3dsg ? Maybe some demos but forget a complete game, they say Since after a period training I want to start my game, must I expect any bad surprises in the future ? I realize that asking this question here can sound a little silly However some reviews were so harsh that I suspectd that the author was not even in good faith but, a doubt....
You do the math, it's easy, hopefully. 3DGS games usually have teams of no more than 10 at most (unconfirmed, but the general idea). For commercial games, teams can pass 100, even reaching 300 or more. With 300 members going at it, not only will a game be done faster (with 1 year of work, it's like 300 years to an individual). It's all a matter of how much group effort is going on. My 2D game, for example, has taken me at least 4 months of actual work, and it's more around the beginning days of the Genesis era in some ways. If I had my sister working at it, of which she's good at art, the time needed would be reduced significantly. Also, read my signature. Don't go trying to do a Doom 3 or GTA Vice City (not sure of the second one's name). Those games are very complex and they likely took a team of 100 members 2 years working 8 hours a day to make them. Do the math, it's all there. Instead, learn the tools and try replicating a classic, like pong or the original Mario. Once you've mastered that, go to something more complex like a game from the Genesis era, then go to the Playstation era and keep advancing.
If you're bad at math or don't want to figure it out, it'll take 800 hours' work (100 8-hour days) for a single individual to make a low-end Genesis-level game. For a modern game, it takes 6 times longer (assuming about 20 months) for about 100 times as many members. Given this, it'd take an individual 480,000 hours to do, which converts to 54 3/4 years. In other words, don't expect it. This assumes working 8 hours a day every day (including weekends) and without any technological improvements.
I do tend to agree that MED especially needs some serious updating. SED also needs it, but not as bad. WED is excellent.
"You level up the fastest and easiest if you do things at your own level and no higher or lower" - useful tip
My 2D game - release on Jun 13th; My tutorials
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Re: Why do [censored]::.?
[Re: ulillillia]
#66981
03/19/06 04:33
03/19/06 04:33
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 535 Michigan
ICEman
Developer
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Developer
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 535
Michigan
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Welll... like somebody said.. people dont design their games as often as they should. They gather up a team of the most skilled individuals money can buy.. but then they wing the game as they go along. Also, there is this preoccupation with money instead of making the game which would = money if done right. So many people believe they should be contracted and given a signing bonus...not that their time and skill isnt worth anything.. but it certainly isnt unique enough that I am going to pay you astronomical amounts of money that would leave everyone else pretty poor. I am bad at math but for whatever reason good with graphics.. I would not even try programming in light of that (well actually I did try.. but I never can seem to grasp programming of any kind really). The engine itself is not a bad tool...not the best but unless you want to spend 10 thousand to 5 million for high end software, I'd suggest you learn to do the best you can.. which judging from most of what I have seen done here, is a far cry from the best this engine is capable of. There is also alot of open source work that can be done to enhance your engine..and alot of times that's what it takes. I talk to Nadester regularly about his game, Biyu Biyu Rocket..and alot of the things he needed for the game..he wrote into his engine. That's the kind of open heart surgery you have to do sometimes. Personally, the only reason I'd want to quit on game development is because circumstances just dont seem to agree with me finding a team with which to create... which they dont but I have at least blind faith in the possibility I'll kidnap some people to work for me successfully.. eventually . In the meantime I have design documents from here to Ya-Ya, because I dont want to give up on my work.
I'm ICEman, and I approved this message.
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Re: Why do some peoples?
[Re: ICEman]
#66982
03/19/06 06:43
03/19/06 06:43
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 202 Southern California, USA
GhostwriterDoF
Member
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Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 202
Southern California, USA
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Frustration? Maybe they are overwhelmed by the concept of what it really takes to develop a game application? AAA companies have mountains of flops before they get their big sellers. Lots of people want or even dream of making games. For me it was a small dream but, a dream nonetheless. The reality is it takes a lot of work and different skills to bring it all together. It is also rare, if at all, there are those who can "do it all". This is why teams are important. If you have GameStudio, then you can work on projects and learn. While you get experience and practice at the skills you enjoy, you can explore other areas of development. If you become very skilled in one or two or more areas, there might even be opportunities to freelance your work for a few coins. Your hobby can pay off in more ways than one, if you are dedicated. Today I was browsing through the manual and saw it has a lot of good information to START with, including a little intoduction to trigonomatry. This however is a GameStudio A6 engine manual and not an encyclopedia of 3D graphics. To "Know your Reference" means that you must get more books or digital reference material. Get as much material as you can to support the environment, and the manual. Take your time, browse through it to "know where to look" when the need arises. Having the tools is nice, having the drive to do something with them is something else. I'm thankful for what I have, and will make the most of it as I am able Thanks again Conitec!
The rivers of time erode away the mountains of existence...
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