Well it's pretty naive to think things as they are now are fine and that it could get worse than now by explaining the real truth.

So many people force their beliefs onto others it's crazy, providing a single correct (and testable) truth probably will actually solve a lot of conflicts. Of course, this is theory, but I would totally be in favor of truth.

Don't forget a lot of religions, as 'great' and 'holy' as they are, are actually the cause of many deaths and ruined lives. Preventing that from continuing is worth far more to me than preventing people from becoming disillusioned by the real truth. Ruining someone's life is pretty relative when it comes to actual killings happening in name of a random religion.

It's not like atheists get into trouble believing there is no God.



Rarity just like complexity really is not an indication of divinity or supernaturality. Something rare might be valuable, but it doesn't mean it's of divine origin or something. :P

Cheers

@PHeMoX
I agree on some of your points such as religions being major reasons for war. But those aren't the people I'm talking about. See as far as I'm concerned, those people are a word that start with the letter "a" and ends with the word holes. I'm sure if you took religion away from those people they would find something else to follow. Don't forget that the fanatics usually have a leader. They follow their leader. What your saying is pretty much if we take away guns the people using guns as a weapon to commit murders will stop killing. But I think you would agree they would just find a new weapon.

I'm really more concerned with the guy who goes to work everyday and loves his wife and kids and maybe even teaches his kids to love other people and to be good humans, blah blah blah...

Again I just don't see how me telling someone there is no god and shattering their world will help.



Well again, it depends how you look at it. When I stopped believing there was a god it made me completely depressed. I still wish sometimes I could go back to believing in something other then rotting in the ground at the end. I didn't realize how safe it made me to even possibly believe their might have been a god. Some might call it weak or whatever, but I don't think believing in something that makes you happy is wrong, even if what you believe in isn't true (as long as you don't hurt anyone else I don't care what you do or what you believe). Of course now I'm over it, but my girlfriend seems to be only now realizing it and seems to have a much harder time with it.

Going back to that quote, one could say since you might not be worried about going to hell then people might go out and kill. Of course your going to argue not all atheists go out and kill and don't worry about consequences, but that's when I would agree and say not all religious people go out and start wars.

Well, but it only shows the consequences of such deep rooted beliefs, it doesn't change the fact it's not quite the best way to stay uhm happy.



Yes, of course there are leaders, but fact remains religion among certain other things makes people vulnerable to such leaders. A leader without something he could people convince into believing, is a powerless leader.



I was talking about groups of people, not individuals. Even people not believing in God might end up in a straight jacket environment after having done God knows what kind of crazy violent stuff. But.. what if that particular atheist would somehow easily convince others of his insane ideas? He would be equally as dangerous, but there's nothing as powerful as religion when it comes to controlling the masses,

Cheers

I thought evolution applied to all until we found in man (and some animals) there was a missing link that no one has yet convincingly explained.
Apparently we should not be evolved as we are for the time it took.
Even the proponent of evolution (Darwin) in his earlier books wrote about this missing link, which baffled him too, and still baffles others today.
I suppose that is why it leaves it open for all sorts of theories from aliens and genetic manipulation etcetera.
Maybe its better we don't find out, but then again that's part of the fun of living, being curious.

Is there a god? Hmmm, tricky.

After seven and a half million years of deep thought, taking into account
Evolution - AKA Intelligent design (by nature),
Intelligent Design - AKA Selected Evolution Success Stories,
The Big Bang - where a single everything starts filling the eternal nothing,
The Great Green Arkleseizure - where the entire universe was sneezed out of the nose of "GOD",
Science - a way of proving we dont know everything,
Religion - a way of believing we dont need to know anything,
Technology - a way of measuring how much we know,
Heaven - a place to go and commit even evil deeds with Gods permission,
Hell - a place where all masochists pray to God to be sent,
AND SO, bearing all this wisdom in mind, dotting all the one's, crossing all the
eyes, and not forgetting to carry the teas, I give you THE ANSWER.
Errr....
Ummmm.....
You're not going to like this, but....
POSSIBLY

My reasoning is this,
If I DO believe in God, its because I believe HE is real, because Ive seen or heard ENOUGH proof to satisfy ME.
If I DONT believe in God, its because thats the way he made me, to use the gift of FREE WILL as best I may.

And thats how I live. I TRULY and EMPHATICALLY believe that God MAY exist.
Why dont I do what the Bible says? Because God granted me the gift of THOUGHT.

And if I end up at the pearly gates, and St Peter yells "What the hell did you do THAT for?"
I'll just say, "God made me the way I am, and I thought it seemed the right thing to do at the time."
I reckon he'll probably just say, "Oh, OK, in you go then. And dont forget your complimentary harp."

Alex

in my opinion it is just an emotional issue

Some people believe in God just because they feel the presence of lord around them.Some others the direct opposite

I dont think that it is possible to turn a believer into an atheist or the other way round just using rational arguments

After all the discussions also in this forum nobody has ever changed his mind

This is true in the short \ medium run, I mean 1 or 2 generations

an other matter in the long run
If people , in general, are nowadays less religious than in the past it is due to the fact that science has razed to the ground many ( not all ) mile stones of religion

I think the possible reason for all the confusion is that we seem to want/need to take one and reject the other.

I like truly EvilSOB's perception of things.

This is really a prelude to accepting that both beliefs are probably as valid as one another, meaning one without the other will get us nowhere.

In most cultures, if not all, spirituality seemed to have been replaced with materialism, that itself is on the verge of being replaced again by spirituality, maybe it's this cycle that allows us to really perceive. After all we know that both sides must be heard in order to get the truth of the matter.

i want to go back to the original discussion..
i dont belive in god, because the pure definition of god makes him impossible, see the old question: can the allmighty god create a stone he cant lift himself? no matter what you answer, its always the same, god cannot be almighty.
and if he is not almighty, what defines him as god? if he is just some powerfull beign, he neccesarily has to be a god liek entity.
also, science has disproven god for so many times.
like the fact that energy exists. you cannot create energy, you can only change the way it exists, i.e. make it liquid or turn it into gas.
the whole universe is based on that concept, why in the universe should we punky humans be the sole exception to that rule with our soul?
also, a soul is nonexistant, for your counciousness is nothing more than the result of your impresions and knowledge throughout the time you are on this planet.
how else could it be possible to reporgram a human being so that he is someone completely different?
also, even IF there is a god, why would he care about us anyway?
if you create bacteria, you dont care about them aswell. if you throw away garbage and stuff, billions of organisms live in there, and you dont care.
there is no god, no heaven and no hell, no fate, destiny or whatever.
absolutely everything that exists can be explained scientifically. not by me, but by people who know their stuff.
of course, people who belive wont accept my logic, for they create a flaw they can exploit, but that is your problem.
id rather enjoy my life for what it is than try to pease a non existing entity by suffering for no reason whatsoever...

Whenever I'm in doubt whether there is a God or not, I look out the window and tell myself: Look at all that. There must be a God.

And you see the sun moving in the blue sky and you claim...oh we are at the center of universe...
The scientific progress has alwayes been a struggle of a minority against the so called, common sense of the rest of us