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Re: Global warming: Why are we so slow to act?
[Re: adoado]
#279077
07/16/09 14:28
07/16/09 14:28
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,771 Bay City, MI
lostclimate
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Expert
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,771
Bay City, MI
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@lostclimate: This is the typical american view ^^ That's way most of the people in america are overweight, that's way the car industry crashes that easy, that's way the rainforest get's destroyed, that's way a lot of animals die out, ... The list is endless! Ignorance is a typical american thing. The reason I dont care is because to be honest I could care less what happens to anyone or anything after I die. You are right, you won't live anymore when the results of global warning will be a real problem but your children, and their children. I for myself am thinking that the real problem of global warning is in china and all those countries where a catalysator for example aren't officialy required and of course the way we make our current. I live in austria, so we don't have problems with producing clean current (because of the rivers) but caloric power plants are one of the biggest polluters. It's not about ignorance, it's about me using resources around me to make my life better. I will not be having kids and dont really care if anyone ever procreates again. Why does everyone have this obsession with thinking that the human race is important in some way? The reason I dont care is because to be honest I could care less what happens to anyone or anything after I die. So imagine right now, some major event affected you, and you know it was due to people (now passed away) who had the chance to stop it, for very little sacrifice. Personally, I would be angry. We need to think more holistic (?) and think about future generations. Just as you would happily invest in real estate, knowing in 20-30 years your children will benefit when it's value increases, why not invest in a clean, sustainable, and ultimately, fair chance of a life equal or better than we are experiencing. I would think they are doing the bast for them in there life which is the logical thing to do.
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Re: Global warming: Why are we so slow to act?
[Re: EvilSOB]
#279078
07/16/09 14:31
07/16/09 14:31
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Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,177 Netherlands
PHeMoX
Senior Expert
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Senior Expert
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Posts: 8,177
Netherlands
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The information he is using conflicts with itself The information he is using is incomplete (and perhaps outdated) at best, but it certainly does not conflict with itself at all. In fact, most of what he's been saying has been high school lesson material for Dutch students for decades already. He's only making a fool out of those who don't know this already by painfully showing how little the average American knows about this subject. The fact that he made it a 'hot topic' is severely overrated in the whole debate anyway, let alone the fact that he did not do the research and he did not come to the conclusions he is propagating to as many people as possible. So.. I don't think he should be credited for any of that. In a way I agree he should just zip it, as he's making money off of this now. It's almost plain stupid to attack him claiming he doesn't know what he's talking about. In fact, the irony in comments like those is that the basic idea when it comes to global warming is actually extremely easy to grasp, let alone that most naysayers do not know anything about the topic at all, but just feel threatened. :p Why does everyone have this obsession with thinking that the human race is important in some way? I could ask the very same thing about why people are obsessed with religion and Gods and all that. Trust me, there's no easy answer. I think most people do have this idea that we can mean something by acting in a certain way. Basically changing the world to maximize what we can get out of it, is a great idea. Don't forget people are already dying because of over-pollution...
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Re: Global warming: Why are we so slow to act?
[Re: PHeMoX]
#279083
07/16/09 14:35
07/16/09 14:35
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,232 Australia
EvilSOB
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Australia
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Personally, I think most of the people making the big noises on this subject, are the sort of people who can make money JUST by making big noises...
"There is no fate but what WE make." - CEO Cyberdyne Systems Corp. A8.30.5 Commercial
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Re: Global warming: Why are we so slow to act?
[Re: EvilSOB]
#279085
07/16/09 14:39
07/16/09 14:39
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Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,177 Netherlands
PHeMoX
Senior Expert
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Senior Expert
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,177
Netherlands
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Personally, I think most of the people making the big noises on this subject, are the sort of people who can make money JUST by making big noises... Which is always a shame, because people on both sides of this topic have relevant things to say. If Al Gore really thought the topic was important, he shouldn't even have asked money for his 3rd grade power point presentations for sure. Making the global warming a very commercial thing already backfires like crazy. It's stupid.
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Re: Global warming: Why are we so slow to act?
[Re: EvilSOB]
#279265
07/17/09 06:56
07/17/09 06:56
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 503 Australia
adoado
OP
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OP
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 503
Australia
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1) In a (relativly) small, closed and controlled environment. YES....On a global scale - never PROVEN. 2) YES - CO2 "production" has risen to almost THREE times the amount it was in 1980. 3) WRONG - In my opinion. See my answer to two, BUT temperatures have not increased AT ALL since 1980. For more info on 3), look-up our Aussie Pollie Senator Steve Fielding with a piece of paper he is trying to show to Al Gore. I have seen this same (basic) information from several different sources, for several years. 1) It is the chemical nature of the molecule to act as a greenhouse gas. 3) Sorry, from what I read, the sources I have seen look way more valid - they actually show the scientist's name who's presented the 'facts'. A politicians view is more biased for self gain than scientists who spend years researching the topics. I'm sure you will find 'proof' that the moon is actually purple somewhere out there ^^ I would think they are doing the bast for them in there life which is the logical thing to do.
I'm sure if you were stuck in a collapsed building, and someone has a chance to help you, but would rather go home and not miss the next episode of "House", you would not make that claim. Note the stupid alternative here - watching TV. As a whole, we need to do very little to attempt to prevent climate change. Personally, I think most of the people making the big noises on this subject, are the sort of people who can make money JUST by making big noises... I do not blame scientists for making noise about it? Them more than anyone would know how to interpret gathered data, and if they see a potential disaster to our environment, good on them for letting us know. It's just that it is inconvenient as we must make a compromise on our lives, which many sadly are unable to commit to.
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Re: Global warming: Why are we so slow to act?
[Re: adoado]
#279430
07/17/09 15:43
07/17/09 15:43
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,771 Bay City, MI
lostclimate
Expert
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Expert
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,771
Bay City, MI
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I'm sure if you were stuck in a collapsed building, and someone has a chance to help you, but would rather go home and not miss the next episode of "House", you would not make that claim. Note the stupid alternative here - watching TV. As a whole, we need to do very little to attempt to prevent climate change.
yes, but if I was stuck in building 5,000 years later, and he could never drive his car again, or use a plastic bag, or use hairspray, or have an efficient power planet that he didnt have to pay a fortune to every month, to save someone that doesnt even exist yet. then no, I wouldnt care.
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Re: Global warming: Why are we so slow to act?
[Re: adoado]
#279601
07/18/09 12:29
07/18/09 12:29
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Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,177 Netherlands
PHeMoX
Senior Expert
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Senior Expert
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,177
Netherlands
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As a whole, we need to do very little to attempt to prevent climate change. I think you're underestimating the change needed to counter or prevent climate change. Personally I think it's stupid to want to 'prevent' climate change. That's unlikely to even be possible as it's also a natural event. But there are certainly things like over-pollution and burning up of fossil fuels that can be reduced or changed... But really... I don't see any sign of oil companies even wanting to change their way of making money. I'm sure the consumers will make sure all the oil will be gone before the more serious steps are being made changing to electric or bio-fuel cars. After all, who's controlling the market? Automobile companies and oil companies and because there are a whole lot of people who drive cars, there will be a huge demand for fuel. Changing that would mean changing cars of billions of people. That's simply not going to happen before the oil is gone.
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Re: Global warming: Why are we so slow to act?
[Re: adoado]
#279614
07/18/09 13:08
07/18/09 13:08
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,232 Australia
EvilSOB
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,232
Australia
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1) It is the chemical nature of the molecule to act as a greenhouse gas. 3) Sorry, from what I read, the sources I have seen look way more valid - they actually show the scientist's name who's presented the 'facts'. A politicians view is more biased for self gain than scientists who spend years researching the topics. I'm sure you will find 'proof' that the moon is actually purple somewhere out there ^^ Dont be sorry, you have earned your opinion by reading more than newspapers and TV. Im not saying THE piece of paper Fielding is waving is important, but look back for the documents it was pillaged from. 1) Im not saying its not a "greenhous" gas, but on a global scale, there are many natural factors resisting it. After all, if CO2 has TRIPLED in the last 30 years, why havent we seen any "significant" climate change? (PS Im freezing my tits off here while typing this!)3) I saw this information YEARS ago, in scientific journals, not the daily telegraph. Back then it did have scientists names attached to it, long before Fielding started waving it around. After all who is to say the whole climate-change issue isnt the same as ONE article I saw over 10 yars ago. A well-documented, researched and endorsed study by a well-respected (by scientists) article that showed conclusivly that WATER CAUSES CANCER !!!! Since when he has never been heard of again. Now either scientists are human and can make mistakes, or there is a conspiricy to hide the dangers of water. Make up your own mind.
"There is no fate but what WE make." - CEO Cyberdyne Systems Corp. A8.30.5 Commercial
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Re: Global warming: Why are we so slow to act?
[Re: EvilSOB]
#279637
07/18/09 14:43
07/18/09 14:43
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Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,177 Netherlands
PHeMoX
Senior Expert
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Senior Expert
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,177
Netherlands
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After all, if CO2 has TRIPLED in the last 30 years, why havent we seen any "significant" climate change? (PS Im freezing my tits off here while typing this!) Any climatologist would argue 30 years is by far not long enough to be able to say anything useful about climate change in the long run. 30 years on a couple of billion years is nothing. In fact, looking back at information about past time climate changes, we're really not in any danger at all. Did you know it used to be a whooping +10 degrees Celcius hotter in most places on Earth a couple of million years ago? Oh, and it had more to do with the Earth's orbit around the Sun and volcanic activity (plate tectonics-related stuff) than anything different. I'm not convinced our current influence is a big as those two factors in the old days used to be. Then again, obviously things will go wrong from the moment where our influence turns out to be irreversible.
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