Problems with tutorials?

Since we put a user feedback form on our website a couple of weeks ago, we got feedback that we didn't expect. We learned that obviously the #1 problem of users is the lack of a lite-C tutorial. The #2 problem is the fact that our lite-C tutorial is outdated and contains C-Script instead of lite-C.

Now in the real world, our lite-C tutorial is not outdated and never contained C-Script, and it's located close to the top of the download page under the big red title "Tutorials". Nevertheless, new users appear to have all sorts of problems identifying the lite-C tutorial and using it.

I had heard this before, but had not taken this seriously - but apparently it is. Can you describe your experiences and problems with finding and using our lite-C workshops? I'm interested in some suggestions about what we could improve here regarding visibility and content.

My guess:

People downloaded from
http://www.conitec.net/english/gstudio/download.php

instead of
http://www.conitec.net/english/gstudio/litec.php

The first link has some more stuff besides the Lite-C workshop, which maybe cotnains C-Script? (haven't downloaded and tried).

C-Script instead of Lite-C... maybe the requests were not formulated correctly and the real problem is the Lite-C-Script mixed manual, which imho indeed IS a problem.
I've been using this engine since 1997, and I've been through A3 WDL, A4 WDL, A5/6 WDL and now Lite-C. I'm used to changes, I know which commands are old, which ones are new and what belogns to what. Still, sometimes the manual confuses me and then I find out that the example is C-Script and not Lite-C.
I can only image how a newbie feels in this case.
I remember I had a hard time getting used to A3 WDL which was a LOT less complex...

No, both pages contain the same tutorials - the C-Script confusion probably results from downloading A6 based user tutorials from AU. Those tutorials are not for beginners. But I'm wondering why users manage to find the rather hidden AU tutorials and overlook the official tutorial.

However I'm also open for hints in which way a confusion could arise for beginners from the lite-C and C-Script sections in the manual.

Hm, my intention was, that they probably download those too:

Game Design Tutorial 1 English German (WED & MED Editors - ~9 MB - May 2007)
Game Design Tutorial 2 English German (WDL Game Templates - ~24 MB - May 2007)

At least the second one sounds like C-Script...

AU is not hidden at all.... it's linked right at the same place

Acknex Unlimited (Tutorials by Users Archive - monthly updated)

(edited my first post above)

Hmm, the game template tutorial contains no script at all, it just describes the user interface.

But maybe we can put a warning on the AU tutorial page.

I personally don't have problems finding anything, but I've been with gamestudio for a long time.

A possible solution would be to package the tutorials with the trial download, and give an option (on by default) to launch them when setup is finished.

Something like:
[ ] Launch Lite-C workshop (for programmers)
[x] Launch game design workshop (for artists/designers)

The website looks professional nowadays, but there is a lot to be improved regarding usability. You should keep in mind that there will be many users who are very excited about the idea of creating games, but don't want to read entire pages from top to bottom. I think it would be a good idea to have a "getting started" page that directs to usefull resources.

I know that the info on such a page is already available on the website, but the point is that it must be behind a big shiny button. How should a new user know that to get started with lite-c he shouldn't go to "AU resources" or something? People don't read the entire page and chose the best option, they take the first option that looks like it might be what they need, and lose interest after checking several pages that turn out to not be what they need.

The button "Gamestudio Download" doesn't immediately convey that tutorials can be found there. An impatient user might conclude that that's only where he downloads gamestudio, and not bother to even look at the page to find the tutorials.

I could go on, but maybe it's best that you find some information on usability engineering or find someone to do it for you. Who knows how many users don't know how to find the feedback form? Or how many users are swamped with info they don't need and click away the page without buying gamestudio?

Imagine you want to learn Italian and buy a 2-in-1 book which includes lessons for Spanish as well.
Both languages are very similar, yet not the same. But as both languages are new to you, you have to find out first.

Maybe you'll end up with sth. like Spanlian and next time prefer to buy a book which focuses on just one language

I got also some interesting responses on my (german, though) RUDI workshop. Most people complained about that the source is "kinda different" from the things used in Gamestudio. I realized that most people just read the tutorials and never figured out that Lite-C has something to do with C.

I think, when introducing Lite-C to the reader, the first thing should be really a differentiation between Lite-C as programming language and the engine being "hinged" in. All engine instructions and stuff are just engine stuff, not "really" integral part of Lite-C.

It is a very.. hmm.. complicated thing. On the one hand a new user wants to "do stuff" with the engine and with Gamestudio. On the other hand he doesn't learn Lite-C (or better: C) programming if he just uses the engine commands and gets no insight in the power of the with the pointer concept, structs and some basic datastructures, etc. Though, when going to much or too fast into this direction and the user loses interest because its "non-game-related" programming.

If I would asked to do something, I would start taking one of those excellent open books (if the license allows this), adapting to Lite-C (because C and Lite-C are a bit different), while adding examples showing something nicely with the engine instruction. I would not start to reinvent the wheel!

What is the password on the zipped samples for the workshop when extracting?

Mayby have something like for Begineers, for Moderate to Experiance, for Experiance reference beside the tutorials downloads?..

Or something along those lines..

Just an idea, but when I come to websites describing engines, I like it very much to "see" something, and not to have to read what this programm can do and how to start with it. What about creating some engine wideos? They could be used for advertising, and for giving tutorial and information in the same way. You could nicely present some of the engines powerful features and in the same time show the workflow with the several editors, and what belongs to what. Of course you can't teach LiteC to the user this way, but I think beginners that are browsing your site "on the way" have most problems with "vocabs". So what is wed?, what is med?, what is the difference between LiteC and sed?, what has c-Script to do with this all?, and where do I go for A6 instead of A7? These simple questions could be answered "eye candy", most people simply don't read sites (or even small sentences) of information, even if they are interested. But watching a good looking movie is simple.

Hiya.

I think it's organization that's the problem. Maybe have two simple "Download A6 Stuff" and "Download A7 Stuff" links. Each one goes to a new page. On that page are three columns: "World Editor (WED) Tutorials", "Model editor (MED) Tutorials", and "Script Editor (SED) Tutorials". Under the Script Editor column, it's divided into three cells; "Lite-C", "C-Script", "Templates".

Now, each of those 'sections/cells' has download links to their appropriate tutorials.

Simple, organized and easy to update.