Shadows Plugin Beta Version and more...

Hi game freaks!

It's finally time to present you the new shadow beta demo, here is the download link:
Download Beta Demo the password is "a7"
(^^this is a link to a german file hosting site, just search for the "Download" button.)



Please tell me what you think about it. I hope it works on your PCs.
FOR THIS VERSION YOU NEED Shader Model 3, but the final version also supports sm 2_a
Greetings,
Chris

works fine, looks great. i especially like that shadows get blurred more if they are casted by a higher object. only drawback - flickering when you move camera\object, but i suppose it's hard to get rid of(probably higher rendertexture resolution on lower shadowrange?)

Great work anyways

Holy Shit.
it runs smooth. and at constant 70fps.

it is all great. shadows are awesome.
one thing though i guess it will stay this way.(This happens on many AAA titles too.):



and this entity transform tools are pretty nice. Do you plan any further development of it(a niec realtime editor ?)

What to say? It's AMAZING!!!
And it's around 47 fps. Not bad.

BTW, are you gonna share that?

I know you said, and a message popped up, but
MAN it looks bad in VS2.0, PS2.0 !!!
Try it out, makes you feel stoned!

Dont worry, I'll give a more useful opinion when I get home and try it out on a REAL computer.

But wouldnt a test on my dogbox-work machine be valid if you has the shader-fallbacks enabled?
So WE know, what it looks like on older machines, or arent the fallbacks finished yet? (being Beta and all)

COOL!

I have been looking forward to this day for a long time Chris3d. Can't wait to check this out as soon as possible.

I'm having very high expectations!

WOW! Been toying around with it now and I am NOT disappointed! It's amazing quality and a solid 70 fps. I can't wait for the final release.

@Quadraxas: you only see the window, because the model is not closed at the bottom.
This is not a bug in the shader, but a mistake in the geometry of the model!

@Cowabanga: Well, I want to sell it for 10 euro, but I have to check out, how much taxes I have to pay...and see if it's profitable...

@EvilSOB: as I said, shader model 2 is not supported yet,there are no fallbacks, at the moment. But when I make the support, it would be nice, if you can test it again

Hints: YOU can hold the Shift button and move the object to copy it(can't copy groups at the moment).
With Ctrl you can group objects temporary. Hold Ctrl an click on the parameters in the GUI to move/rotate/scale all values.

Oh, and if you want a better bloom change this:

TO:

The engine is loaded, then a black window appears and then... baammmm.... Bluescreen and the system reboots ^^
Tried it 2 times.

Specs.:
Laptop
Windows XP Professional SP 3
GFX: ATI Mobility Radeon X1400 (Shadermodel 3.0 supported)
DX: 9.0c (November 08)
Intel Centrino Core 2 duo 1.66 GHz

your drivers needs to be updated.(BSoD seems like a driver issue)

You need to update DirectX (March 2009 build).

Runs smoothly with 4 FPS on my laptop! I would like to lower down the splits and the resolution, but I can't - or my laptop is too slow to manage that

Any speedup is appreciated - this looks promising.

Hi

does NOT work for me; says "d3dx9_40.dll missing"

update DirectX and now works

this is what i get:


hope this helps ya

Hi,

It works fine on mine PC. It looks very good. 50 FPS with a Geforce 8600 GT. Nice shadows.

Bye
White_Wolf

yeah i got that too, add wait(1); to begining of the startup functions.

Nice and neat!


You don't need to pay taxes or whatever if you're gonna put it in PayPal.

hi,

looks fine. But whats the Technique behind? With shader blurred Stencil Shadows?

It runs on my "Hellmachine" - Laptop with 70 FPS and activate all 4 Ventilators while running.

,gri

hi

I don't see something (shadows) I think its due to my graphic card.

ATI Radeon HD3870
Windows XP SP3
latest DirectX and graphics driver

gri, it's shadowmapping with PCSS and PSSM. the framerate is set to 70fps by code, look in the shadowdemo.c file!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
AND IT IS A BETA VERSION!!!!!! BETA MEANS: NOT FINISHED AND SLOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! OK?

@Quadraxas: on my vista system it also doesn't work, where did you exactly put the wait(1); ?

@zSteam: the next version, supports ps_2_0 and ps_2_a and b!

Oh...I never said its to slow.
As I read the posts here and saw that no one has more than 70 FPS, I had already the Suspicion that you locked the frames_max to 70, without checking the Code.

No reason for so many Exclamation Marks. I'm on your Side!

,greetings gri

@Chris3D:
material.c line 33 as first line of FXLoad_startup() before effect_loads.

Works great with my Vista.

It's the same with my system I see the demo just fine, but without any shadows, but it's not because of shader version 3, as I have a HD4850.

Does it work for other ati users? May be it's an issue of ati...

yep same problem here, can't see any shadows. I'm running an older ATI HD2600 which can still support shader model 3, even 4 i believe.

yeah executable works but we re talking about the code.

Oh, the code isn't working with me.

ok thanks, but why won't SM3.0 on ati work?

I've updated my DX and am still having a blue screen.

Hmmm... I didn't found any new drivers for my card.

Ati Mobility Radeon X1400 (VS/PS 3.0)

it looks and works beautifully for me, i too didnt have the latest dx, i just dl'd the dll from a free dll website tho, prolly should update my dx, but i didnt feel like it. I cant wait for this to come out.

An astonishing 1 FPS, but it works
And that with an intel chipset on a notebook...

doesnt help here...

a few posts earlier, materials.c on material_startup function (around line 35) before all effect_load() s.

now i get this:


but the fx file looks ok to me

In the "mtl_terrainmulti2" material, the ".fx" and double quotes are missing in the effect file name. I think a STRING name wont work here.

effect = "MLTITex2.fx";

Once you fixed it it runs like a charm! This is the best A7 app that I have ever seen!

Update!

Here is the new Beta Version 0.3;
it is much faster now, supports shader model 2 and has a Depth of Field shader.

Download Link
pass: "a7"

IT RUNS WITH 350 FPS ON MY PC.
(when the Navi is not rendered)
DON'T USE THE DEBUGMODE (F11) TO CHECK THE FPS, YOU LOSE A LOT OF FRAMES!!!

Greetings,
Chris

@gri: sorry man, I misunderstood you!

@all: thank you for the helpful posts!!

edit: I forgot to update the object triangle count:
download updated dll file
(put that in the Plugins folder and override the old)

beautiful, i get a min fps of 230 and a maximum of 490

109 FPS.

min fps of 180...

@lostclimate: What are your system configurations?!! o.O

I have a crappy intel dual core processor, 4gb of ram and a nvidia 9600GTX, the 490 was only in the caves and or if you didnt look at much of the models.

Runs very nicely now.
170 fps from far and about 80 when close to the house.

How is this going to perform when the amount of object is increased?
Like a small town or lots of trees?

499 in caves(is it even goes beyond that?) around 330 when everything is in sight(whole terrain) and around 250 when i center the house.

Hello,

Nice, yet have I a minimum of 160 FPS. Good work.

bye
White_Wolf

damn, i get this:
Error E1512 Empty prototype called in set_shadow_options

and than the scene is shown without any shadows

edit: ok, i, too updated to the latest directX and now it works and the errors are gone!

and it looks really cool!

interesting!

great work.

- between 420 and 499 in lowest screen resolution (windowed mode)
- between 200 and 250 in highest screen resolution (windowed mode)
- always 59 FPS in full screen mode

GF 9800 GTX

I saw some gaps between some objects and shadow map.

Did you ever test with lots of foliage like a small forest? Does it work similar?

I have something like this in mind:
http://www.garagegames.com/community/blogs/view/16853
(they use some split shadow mapping for large outdoors)

with a 7600GS
50 - 80 fps

It runs incredible fast compared to the previous version! If I hit the 1 key to use a lower resolution, I get nearly 40fps on my laptop. Amazing.

Remarks:
- I see no DOF?
- everything looks too crisp to me. Is it somehow possible to run a blurring filter over it like we are used to blur stencil shadows?
- Does it work with particles, too - are they casting shadows, too?

to activate dof, you need to activate panel and navigation thing.

uncomment the line Render_navi(); from script and turn dof on.

(it works with aa if this helps with crisp)

I'm still having a blue screen...

hi,



1600 * 1200 in Fullscreen = 59 FPS with my Laptop.

what if an entity moves at runtime under the palmtree ?
Does it get'in "shadowed" too or have I to check the groundtexture ?

,gri

@ dark samurai: did you update to the latest directX version? you should also update your gpu driver. Do you have the latest a7 version? can you give me more details about your system, maybe we can fix the problem.

@ gri, at the moment you can only cast shaodws of objects that have no animation, I want to implement this too!
In the beta:
if you activate the Render_navi() function and use the translation tool you can update the matrix of an object. But I will include a function, that can update the matrix of a single entity or all entities (for the shadows).
Particles are not supported yet, but it is possible, I will try that soon.

DOF and other stuff: you don't need to include the Render_navi() function ! you can also scroll down(in the shadowdemo.c file) and edit this function:



my next plan is a lod system, this should as well give performance.

I noticed that the leaves are still well light even when the sun is directly behind them.
Is that intention to simulate transparency? It looks a little odd when everything else is dark on the backside but not the tree tops.

Is it also normal that the frame count goes way down when I go close to the window or the door when they have shadows on them?
I loose about have...

Apart from that, it's absolutely amazing! This takes the Gamestudio graphics to the next level.

I just tried a forest of 250 palm trees and the performance loss is really not that bad. I'm still at about 40 frames.

My system (notebook):
Intel Core 2 Duo T9400 2,53 Ghz
GeForce 9650M GT (1GB)
4 GB Ram
Windows Vista

Hi Hitsch, yeah the palmleaves, I hate them... I still have a problem with alpha textures. When I gave them a groundshading they almost get black, because they are single sided. Therefore, I disabled the groundshading of the entity. you can change that when you delete this:
in the shadowdemo.c file.
Or you gave all entity NO groundshading:



But than you should write your own groundshading in the effect file of your entity or you get ugly artefacts(try to hide them with the shadbias value).
You could use this function in your shaders e.g.:

^^output this as a COLOR of your vertex shader and use it in the pixelshader.

about the framecount: yes that is normal, i think that has something to do with the textures...well I will check this out, thanks for the hint.
I will improve the alpha stuff as well ...the next beta is in process...

Ok the driver update did it!

Man I love it! It's really fast and looks good especially when using the 5x5 Edge Blur.
I hope that you can finish this soon.

Great work

Hi, I will hopefully finish it in the middle of may!

Oh year,
Your Pictures Are looking very nice,
At the moment i am updating my drivers, because i cant see shadows(on xp and vista).
I have the Ati HD 4870

I'lll tell you later if it works in my system

Rackscha

for me not work?
I have a mobile hd3470 with shader 4.0 support
and windows vista
appear the problem is ATI card

+ Update DX
+ Update your GFX driver

What doesn't work? Do you get a bluescreen, or are the shadows not displayed?

All update
the problem is the shadows not display

I have the same problem: Cant see any shadows

Does your videocard supports VS/PS shader 2.0 ?

This different chipset situation really makes you go insane. This shadow works ok at my ATI card though (Asus ATI x1650). But i also made a PSSM shader and it aint workin at NVidia chipsets. Since this demo works OK with NVidia i want to ask something. I am suspicous about the problems source is about render target at my PSSM shader. Did u use z_buffer or did u use bmaps to pass the depthmaps to shadow calculating shader???

for me support to shaders 4.0
Direcxt 10.1
and backward compatible

So you have an ATI... Nvidia cards are not DirectX 10.1 compatible, right?

yes right
ti hd3470 mobile 256 VRAM

Well, I don't see any shadows, too.
I have a Nvidia Geforce 9800 GTX+, 512 MB VRAM, Shader 3.0.
"Only" DirectX 10.0.

idk, i see them with my 9600 gtx so it has to be a driver or broken system issue.

Can see the shadows now; was a DirectX error.

how you fix?

Well, I installed DirectX.

Hi guys!

In a week it will be finished (hopefully ) and I will release the final beta. I will not include the grouping function in the release version, this you can get in a later update(free). But the omni, direct and spot lights were added (new).
C3D

I am looking forward to test this

cool

This is excellent news! EXCELLENT!!!

Cool news! Keep it up!

Great news!

download doesnt work anymore

hi guys, it takes a bit longer as I thought, because I have problems with the omni light. At the moment it works, but it is very inefficient (e.g. if you set up 4 omni lights the scene gets very slow 40fps)! I can fix it, but this will take time for a few more days. I don't wanna say that it will be finished till monday, because I don't want to disappoint you anymore. So, it is possible...maybe... we will see sorry Chris

P.S.:
But I can make a new download, if you want to test the current state...should I ?

you need to ask?

Of course!!!
Would be cool!

Ok,
but it is buggy and slow, I notice that the omni lights aren't visible on windows vista systems yet, I have to fix that, too.
Download Beta 0.5

You can delete stuff, with your DEL KEY, maybe I should add a create button

Tested it. What's the different? just slower.

if you want i can host the beta on my server so you dont have to use that host

Hi guys, sorry but at the moment I have no time for the shadow plugin (I am working on the physX plugin). I will finish it, but I don't know when. So here is the last dll, it's free (no limitations)
Download DLL

Thank you Chris3D. I will test it.

I've tested the demo. Great work. Keep it up; someday


EDIT:
The latest demo runs at my pc with over 180 fps!!

you shouldn't use the omni lights, they are slow at the moment. I would advise you to use only the shadows of the sun, with the simple blur- or the edge smoothing shader. the pcss is not working correctly! I will fix it!

I'm a bit confused.
JCL recommands your shadow system as the best avalable for 3DGS at the moment and you stop the development of it?
Are there no negotiations about making it an official part of 3DGS?

I thought the same. I don't understand jcl's plan. Gamestudio urgently needs an official well working shadow solution and it doesn't seem like any user contribution is done any time soon.

http://www.opserver.de/ubb7/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=249412#Post249412

This was my attempt to back up the subject.
I´ve thought that I would get a lot of support from the forum
members. Because that´s the only thing that counts.

I admit, it was rather stupid to start the thread in german.

w00t!!

Bad...

Is it possible that JCL could finish the shadowplugin?

Will this be Gamestudio's official PhysX solution? Will it ever be finished? :p

Just kidding... You are doing a great job. I know that the last 10% of a programming project often are more pain and effort than the first 90%. But maybe Conitec should support such projects in a better way. Something seems to be wrong with this approach if almost nothing ever gets finished (like the earlier level editor projects).

Sorry for pudshing back this topic to top, but does any one have the last build of this shadow dll?(the free version without limitation)?

I would like to use the sun shadows for my project :|


Greets
Rackscha

Sorry for offtopic but:
I haven't seen this topic yet and

This looks great - from what I see in the screenshots

Please finish this

PLEASE PLEASE

Man... dll link is dead reupload some one...

Can anybody re-upload the non-limited shadows.dll again please?

These are my personal thoughts about why this development has been left undone:

As you all know, those users below Professional have almost every technology available to create a "latest generation graphic" videogame.

The shaders are great (Shade-C is what I'm using right now)

As for the post processing and so the shadows: yes we humble Commercial Users have them too, with the bluring as well, they look good BUT they totally kill the framerate EVEN IN SHORT RANGE, and EVEN USING THE LOWEST LOD.

Why is that?

Conitec announces that the shadows from the Professional version are 10 times faster then Commercial or below.

And while a shadow is a.. let's call it "primary need" because it's the one that gives depth to the scene,

normal maps, volumetric lights and all the shiny shaders out there are "secondary needs", for instance even withot HDRL a scene would still look decently.

THEREFORE

Since shadows in general are A MUST and people need them badly, conitec's smart marketing strategy is to offer the FUNCTIONAL version of them only in within the Professional version (nearly 800 euros) while we humble commercials (200 euros) or below are left with total USELESS crap (crap not because they look ugly but because they kill the frame rate).

CONCLUSIONS

A project like this would make the Professional version become OBSOLETE, for the very simple reason that (other professional version features):

1.Nobody cares about the source code -> this engine was released and announced as an easy to use engine, so the few real programmers here enjoy scripting, not hardcode level programming. The rest of us artists load in resources and compile.

2.Nobody cares about the unlimited clients -> this isn't a massive multiplayer engine and it will never be, this was born FROM a shooter engine, PERIOD.
Besides that, the real indie developers know FOR A FACT that a 3man or 5man team trying to create an MMO is wasting hours of work going nowhere, a hopeless jump in the abyss.
Indie developers start with small games, single player adventures maybe something with limited networking like diablo or such. Max 8 clients are enough for that.

So there you go, if you want the working shadows you have to pay additional 600 euros. Honestly that's not worth it, expecially when you realize that EVERY OTHER engine supports them by default.

These are called smart marketing strategies.

And that's why this development was forced to be canceled IN MY OPINION.

Now dear Chris3D will you please provide us with what you've done so far with this code of yours?

THANK YOU VERY MUCH IN ADVANCE

Sincerely,
Pietro

As far as I know, Unity for example doesn´t offer stencil shadows at all, if you don´t buy the pro version for quite a bit more money than GS Pro.
Such a plugin is A LOT of work and that is actually the reason it was canceled, as time just keeps going on at a lot too much speed
There is no way I could imagine that he was "forced" to cancel it. Since I worked on shadows as well, I know that jcl is actually VERY supportive if it comes to developing features like this.
Other features of the pro version, which may make it worth to buy are for example the BSP, the terrain LOD, the automatic LOD generator of MED, the particle system which is a lot faster than with comm and of course the customizable start up window, which can even be comletely disabled as well as the file packing.
If you are seriously developing something with gamestudio those features are easily worth it, as they can save a lot of time.

Damn... I realy need dynamic shadows... I need this .DLL, I know this shadows works only with terrains and models... But I need it to work with level blocks as well... I don't know any thing about shaders... Please upload it...or give me some alternative...

that's usefull,,,

thx

Hi guys,

I am working on my portfolio right now as you might know. So no time for shadow plugin or pXent. But here is the last uploaded version of my shadow plugin (I think it is the unlimited version):
Download Link

I will upload a new version as soon as I have time for it.
Greets
Chris

Hey Chris, first of all thanks for your quick response. I think the file you've re-uploaded is the one with the 10 minutes lockdown. Infact if you open up the readme inside the zip file you read clearly stated: the shadows.dll is a free beta demo verison, after (around) 10 minutes the dll shuts down.

We'd appreciate if you just posted the non-limited shadows.dll

Waiting for new version of this great shadows man! It will be great if you will just make this shadows work with level blocks. Thank you again bro!!!

I tried to leave it on for a while, it timed out, this indeed is not the full version, would be very nice if you could upload that for us

I love your work Chris, god speed on finding work for you!

regards,

well it's been a while.. where's this shadows.dll with no limitations?
the beta here says that the dll has a timeout

yeah sorry worng dll I will upload the right one on monday

This looks really awesome. May I use your Normal Map Shader? If yes (I already included it :D)how to disable the extra light on each model with this action and how to make the spec-light (I hope you know what I mean) darker? Hope you will help.

It's been a long while again Chris mate, can you post the right dll please?

Will this dll work without render2texture feature(like in A7 extra edition?)

http://www.file-upload.net/download-2250629/shadows_beta_version.rar.html

the light creator doesn't work, but the sunlight works... now with no limitations...for free!
If you use it, credits would be nice

Edit: you can use everything shader models texture (they are from cgtextures)

thanks alot for this! I was secretly waiting for it as well hehehee.

thanks

Hey Chris thanks a lot for this.. I got a problem though I can't figure out why it crashes on me.

I launch your demo and it works fine but when i try to integrate it with my scripts it crashes and say: Error 1513 crash in CreatePlugins, crash in RenderPlugins etc etc

In the beginning I thought it was because of a conflict with shade-c but that had nothing to do with it in the end.

Could it be that my level crashes because I don't load models through script but I already have my own level with models placed in it?

Aww, poor me, no one answering my question
So, will it work with extra edition?

why not just try it?

tested, not working, just need someone else opinion
It just that since it's a dll perhaps it can override the engine(like someone did in render2texture.dll , forgot who make it, I think it's Chris3D too).
BTW, the dll just do not loaded by the engine, while other dll did(like t7.dll, wiimote.dll and renderview.dll)...

1) the render2texture.dll doesn't overwrite anything. It's simply a new implementation of the render 2 texture feature.

2) If the plugin can't get loaded, you are doing something wrong. Maybe the plugin is in the wrong folder or you need to install something (if the plugin is created in Visual Studio you would have to install the Visual Studio Redistributable Package). But only Chris3D knows if there is something that needs to be installed.

3) I guess that the shadows won't work with extra edition because it has no render to texture which is essencial for shadow mapping.

I think you're right...Thanks
BTW, back in A6 ages long time ago, render2texture.dll enable A6Commercial to use view.bmap(which only available in A6Pro), so I/other user can use postprocess shader. And unfortunately it's not working in A7

Ah, stupid me, it seems I forgot the d3dx9_40.dll. Now the engine load the bloom2.dll and shadows2.dll, but I forgot how to use it, I deleted the examples(doh)... Why doesn't it has any error stating that it needs the d3dx9_40.dll?

Downbloading again...

It's really awesome! I have only problems to include the shadow plugin beta in my project. With this lines in main:

on_d3d_reset = CreatePlugins;
on_d3d_lost = DestroyPlugins;
render_entities = RenderPlugins;
set_shadow_options();
CreatePlugins();

I have a error: "acknex.exe found a problem and has to end"(free translation from german hope you know what I mean) and the error: "crash in CreatePlugins." What did I wrong?

Without this lines it works, but of course the Plugin doesn't work. Could you help me?

thnx chris

It works! Thanks Chris, it was awesomely running at 22fps at my PC(judging how old my PC is) The latest plugin needs d3dx9_42.dll. And it work with extra edition of 3DGS(I think it should work with all version include free liteC, and free 3DGS).



Did you also copied the function CreatePlugins()


You should also add the other ...Plugins().

Yes, I have the functions. And now it works. There was an error if I used my menuescript and the plugin together. Now I have to find a way to use both.

Is there any way, to make shadows from level blocks?? Not only from models...

could you create a sprite that is the shape of the item you are using.

Can any one answer my question?! Is there any way to make shadows from level blocks?

I am selling an improved version of the shadow plugin to conitec.
Greets
Chris

fantastic! they can get better recognition with things like this and shade-c etc...etc...

Never tried it, but I think you can use "compile as mesh" option...

I tried doesn't help Please, help me some how. I'm sure, that I'm not the only one who need this shadows work with level geometry! Please help

Hey,

forget the old shadow plugin, the new one will be awesome:


Cascade Spilt Shadow Maps with BoundingBox Selection ala Frostbite Engine plus Blending between each SelectionBox.

There are three splits (red, green and blue), the wireframe is also just a debug effect.

Greets,
Chris

129 fps?

looks very neat

Man, great work btw, does shadows support level blocks?

178fps, but don't look at the fps I have not optimized it yet.
I think the final version will have between 300-400 fps, depending on your system and the amount of tris to be rendered.

The shadows will work with level blocks, but you have to check the "Create Meshes" in the WED MapCompiler.

I've tried to use "Create Meshs" in WED, but didn't help any way Can even upload the demo were I tried

Great work Chris.

(this is the one conitec will include in the engine natively right? or they will buy and use it as a plugin?)

Amazing! Is it out soon or are you selling it to conitec? very excited great work!

well.. this is looking great

-prays its fast and stable enough-

-prays this one gets finished

Looks really great, indeed!

could you implement the option to toggle a fourth split on for large outdoor scenes?

Hey Chris,

Any ETA on that new plugin?
I'm developing a game, that uses your old plugin, but this looks like it's more worthwhile to a game with a bigger outdoor scene. Something i could really use.

regards,

Will this work for versions of A7 that dont have shader support?? Basically below commercial...

Yes, it does magically work on all A7.80 version or above

So it will work for the versions you dont have to pay about £300 for?

why would you have to pay £300 for comm. its only $200USD for us in the US, arent £'s worth more than $USD?

yeah sorry i think I made that up from ages ago... I havent check the prices in a good while... Maybe I was thinking professional...

that makes a lot more sense.