Time for TORQUE...

http://www.garagegames.com/

...and take a look at resources and the price!

seems that every major known lbud engine adds some mobile exporter stuff. JCL said that the new wed and exporters for other platforms are a primary route for A8

I don't trust JCL's assurances - not much process here - predominantly bugfixes and overdue basic functions (not well implemented).
Not much advancement the last versions - the goods are 3rd party tools (network, physics, other goodies)
Every minor version update of GS results in a different/changed behavior of the current projects - titled from JCL as "stupid or worng programming" of the project coder.


TORQUE is more cheap than ever and supports more platforms - even browser.
Time for me to take a deep look...

Sounds very promising!

Well, you should ask to people really using it.

I have read some advices from Machinery_Franck that said, that
some things are broken like portals, culling, lot of bugs remain etc ...

They are making updates, they plan to clean it and fixes bugs existing from years ! But will it be done ????

For price of 99$ indeed it remains a really nice package with
World/terrain/vegetation/shaders editor all in one !

I can not recommend Torque. Too slow and too buggy. Just my opinion.

Well the only big thing i see, is it's Network part , that sounds solid !

I tested their new demo, the problem is that is just a really too simple room with some stuff , not a real gameplay demo
And it really don't run smooth like hell !
It's an empty simple level, without real shaders, no animated ennemies or NPC, no particle effects , no HUD.

They should make like Unity a real convincing gameplay demo level with all stuff, if they really want to attract people !

Looks like Torque has a good marketing team, the site makes the product appear very promising and professional. But refering to ratchet I'd talk to some users first. All the published games look like arcarde games (I see n oAAA title published with Torque) and each engine (IPad, XBox, Wii, PC, 2D, ...) costs money on its own.

I myself will wait for some reports on the engine in this forum and so far, I'll keep using 3dgs.

The best thing is that they offer the whole source as well. That is something you should think of.

I think Gamestudio is on par with Torque from what I saw - when it comes to the engine -- except of some missing rendering effects, a fully programmed deferred lightning pipeline, some PhysX features. Other than that, web publishing and the great editors (at least what I can see) are things which beat Gamestudio of course.

If the source would'nt be included, I would not say that it's maybe worth buying it.

Hell, why do I think of the possibility of making a Torque-exporter to Gamestudio for scenes built with the Torque-World editor??? I'm ill, I think ^^

AFAIK the source code of the previous versions of Torque (TGE, TGEA) is said to be a mess. At least this seems to be a common point of criticism in the reviews on devmaster.net. I dont know though whether this is still the case for Torque 3D as there are no T3D reviews on devmaster.net.
The C4 engine is probably a much better choice in this regard, even if its more expensive.

@HeelX,

insted you should work on one for UDK, it can export FBX with ligtmaps in 2nd uvset now on april beta

AFAIK the source code of the previous versions of Torque (TGE, TGEA) is said to be a mess. At least this seems to be a common point of criticism in the reviews on devmaster.net. I dont know though whether this is still the case for Torque 3D as there are no T3D reviews on devmaster.net.
The C4 engine is probably a much better choice in this regard, even if its more expensive.

Well i agree caus i've seen some Torque 3D C++ maths for additionnal collisions similar to the community tool HitBox Editor made by Superku ; and really i didn't understand
a lot it was realluy too complicated with need to modify several source code files
In comparison C4 engine code i've seen (C++) is lot lot more clear, and there is lot of explanation commentary in the code.

Even with source, i don't think it's the point that can make the difference to buy Torque 3D or not !

The strong points are the editors in the world editor indeed
that speed up your game making caus tools are already here
you've not have to code them !

Decal Editor

But for power and fuildity they should make a real playable level instead of pure graphic and simple 3D room !
I remember a demo they made with shaders, it was fluid but the PC was a rel big monster to make it run fluid !

But well to make little games it can be OK i think ,
you have just to test games like :
-Penny Arcade Adventures
-Hinterland

If you target small game or game partitionned in levels
it can be good perhaps ?

Just tested it

Well in advanced lightennig put on :
Shadows are here for objects, , level meshes are lightampped greatly on terrain : really good !


Terrain Editor :
Terrain just great, ingame you can deform, paint ; and you can use normal maps on terrain (not tested) !

Material editor :
For each object you can tweak on standard slots:
Diffuse, Normal,Specular and choose the texture, no shader
stuff to tweak : Perfect for artists !
And there are some 5 other slots like Glow, detail texture etc ...

Road and river editor :
Just great and functionnal , nothing to say, even underwater color, physic movement parameters
are in and tweakable !

Lightening:
Add sun, scattered sun, clouds, lights ...
All ready to work on your level !
I don't know if there is a light manager, or parameters distance to tweak or if it is entirely to you to activate / deactivate light depending on camera distance ?


Object inspector :
It's like a window showing in game a 3D model in details, you can view/play each animation , view / tweak properties etc ...
Just Great, you tweak your in game.

Physics :
For standards stuff : It's Solid (just play the demo also) !

Performance :
Some good amount of objects without LOD, the level runs smooth ! Now lot of stuff , with NPC, more stuff models, AI, HUD, i think people will have to be clever and do like Industry AAA games and use LOD !
For level based games with a map to travel : no problem at all
i think !



Bugs or missing things :
Yes, footprints where activated, and on terrain with adavnced lightening on shadows, there was polygon of the decal showing
Strange i didn't find any folliage painting tool to paint grass on terrain


My personnal conclusion :

-But strange the simple room demo was smooth but i don't find enought on my computer ???
And the level i made with good stuff was ok on framerate ??
(i think particles can eat power, it's up to you to
activate i think by script as camera comes near like in AAA Games havign some particles LOD quality )

-For 99$ :
Just very solid for 3D artist wanting ready to use tools to make levels with standards shaders, direct terrain, road, rivers, direct lighmapping on terrain etc ... all that on the fly without programming !
And lot lot of parameters are tweakable in properties for each thing !
Well 3D artists can express themselves Directly !
If they want more they have to find a Script programmer or C++ programmer !
I don't have tested what we can do by script : it will be perhaps if i have time the next step !

Well ... i find it's a good deal for 99$ if you can by pass the bugs you'll encounter !
If ask for latest shaders stuff, you'll have to write it yourself or wait ???
It's ready to use !

And well proven you can make commercial games :
Hinterland

Thanx for your great review - faster (and more detailed) than i could
And thanx for the link to the hinterland - clip (I just ordered it to make my mind and play)

I also ordered TORQUE 3D prof. for just €69,74 (that's cheap!) with paypal.
it just took me 2 minutes + download (~1.5h)
[i already own TORQUE 2D]

So let's start diving in...

I bought Torque 2D years ago also : great editors,physic collisions ... great product !

-------------

Well for T3D it was an obective review, not a fan review !

- For Torque 3D what i didn't talked is import of 3D models !
I don't have tested it at all with static or animated models !
I use Blender for animaton, and i don't know if exporters for animations work with Blender 2.49 or last ???

- And i just looked at script !
I didn't used it or tested it deeeply, so i can't say
if you can go far enought with script like controlling characters, and anything else enought to make your
own game and gameplay ?

---------------

For 99$ i'm tempted later to spend that money for such bunch
of tools and engine indeed !
But for now, i target little , casual games , engine needs are defined so ...
I'm using A8 for now, it's lot easy to pick it up and it has great documentation also !

------

What lacks on T3D and 3DGS is Android or Iphone support !
Even for basic 3D !
Mobile market is growing a lot , Android stuff is gaining
terrain a lot, and devices are becoming more and more powerfull !
well ... perhaps in the future ??

Just look at the other engines and their abilities to release cross-platform productions. You know about Unity. UDK can publish to iOS and Android (although they currently dont support the Android port officially). Esenthel can publish to iOS. Crytek was searching for new programmers with experience in mobile area as iOS. Vision3d just got an iOS port and they are working on more platforms at this time.
As far as I know there are also versions of the Torque engines for iOS.

With all this in mind not only indie developers will release games on phones. Also big publishers will flood this market sooner than later. So I would not wait until 3DGS decides to also starts a port. I would make a game as fast as possible, before the big ones will saturate this market, really, do it now or leave it! Even now it is harder than before, you already need quite some good quality to impress the users.

Even now it is harder than before, you already need quite some good quality to impress the users.

Sometimes the idea and gameplay really pays !


Like some games where simple cartoon style (so no shader based game) are greatly and cleverly used with addictive gameplay !

OMG pirates

Sometimes,polished graphics, with addictive gameplay and big replay value makes it :
Infinity Blade
I played it it's simply addictive you want to re make the fight boss lot of times until ypu collect top notch equipment !
The gameplay is combat only,and just choose branching path ,but it works !

Angry Birds it's just physic gameplay addictive that asks you to think how to win a stage !

Guerilla Bob was also simple and great cartoon graphics but
addictive and fun (i just would have liked more vast levels
on the sides, and more diversified levels) !

Guerilla Bob


Well just wanted to point that only good ideas or polished
points on a game will make it work indeed !

The big point is selling and distribution that in AppleStore
really simplifies all, caus you don't have the problem
to find or thrust a publisher !