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Collision detection with Bone Animation? #120088
03/29/07 15:55
03/29/07 15:55
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 197
Y
yorisimo Offline OP
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yorisimo  Offline OP
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I am a new Game Studio user and have done both the C-script tutorial and WED tutorial. I am using 3DGS for visualization for research purposes in which a virtual arm will have its joint angles controlled from an outside program. I used bone animation (ent_bonerotate) to set the desired joint positions, and this works nicely. However, I'm interested in using collision detection so that the arm can interact with objects in the virtual environment. There are 3 main things I would like to do: (1) have objects in the virtual environment move (realistically) when they are touched by the hand model, (2) have the contact force information sent back to the external program to adjust the joint angles, and (3)prevent the arm from traveling through surfaces (e.g. a simulated desk or wall).
Is it possible to use physics or collision detection as I've described while using bone animation? Any other ideas or comments? (I currently have the trial version but am purchasing the Pro Edition.) Thanks!

Re: Collision detection with Bone Animation? [Re: yorisimo] #120089
03/30/07 01:07
03/30/07 01:07
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,503
SC, United States
xXxGuitar511 Offline
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xXxGuitar511  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2006
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Sort of...

My best recommendation would be to use Newton Physics. You would combine several different [invisible] entities to form your arm, and then rotate your good model's bones to match the invisible "skeleton"...


Then you'd just have to figure out how to control your arm's physics...


xXxGuitar511
- Programmer
Re: Collision detection with Bone Animation? [Re: xXxGuitar511] #120090
03/30/07 13:13
03/30/07 13:13
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 197
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yorisimo Offline OP
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yorisimo  Offline OP
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Thanks for the response! Could you restore the link to Newton65 in your User Contribution Posts?


Joris Lambrecht
My Contributions: Relative Rotation, Window Sizing
Re: Collision detection with Bone Animation? [Re: yorisimo] #120091
03/30/07 16:45
03/30/07 16:45
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Posts: 4,427
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A.Russell Offline
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A.Russell  Offline
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Japan

If you want the arm to also be a physics object, you might be better to create the arm completely from physics objects and use constraints for the joints. Be aware that the physics engine uses its own collision system, and they don't always interact together as you might expect. I think that would cause you less head-aches than trying to read the contact forces and calculating the the new joint angles yourself.

Re: Collision detection with Bone Animation? [Re: A.Russell] #120092
03/30/07 17:35
03/30/07 17:35
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 197
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yorisimo Offline OP
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yorisimo  Offline OP
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If I build the arm from separate objects is there still a way to skin the joints? The skin at the forearm and elbow needs to stretch as the joints move (I've gotten a nice looking stretching skin arm to work using bone animation in MED).

The arm itself does not need to be a physics object as we will be controlling its physics externally (This IS necessary as we have a complex model involving dozens of muscle segments and other nonlinear components that is already implemented externally to calculate the joint angles).
Objects that the arm/hand will manipulate should be physics objects. Unfortunately, this conflicts with what the 3dgs manual says: "Non-physics objects must not collide with physics objects, but physics objects can collide with non-physics objects". For example I would like to have the virtual arm pick up a cup. If the person controling the arm causes the arm to hit the cup too fast, the cup should fall over or scoot across the table with specified friction, gravity, etc. (Equal and opposite forces would then be sent back to the external "dynamic arm model" that controls the joint angles of the arm.)

Questions:
(1) Is there a way around the "Non-physics objects must not collide with physics objects" issue?
(2) If the arm does need to be a physics object to avoid this issue, is there a way to prevent the collision results to be displayed and rather send the information to our external model?
(3) Can you have non-physics objects collide with physics objects in Newton?
(where can I get Newton, and information on how to use Newton with A6 engine)

Thanks again for the responses

Re: Collision detection with Bone Animation? [Re: yorisimo] #120093
03/31/07 04:40
03/31/07 04:40
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xXxGuitar511 Offline
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xXxGuitar511  Offline
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For what your looking for, the arm MUST use physics. My "idea" I was trying to convey, was to create an invisible "skeleton" out of several models; for collision. And then, to use your model (with the bones), and rotate/move the bones to match the joints/skeleton position; for looks.


Link for newton example: http://www.innervisionsoftware.com/misc/newton65pp1.zip


xXxGuitar511
- Programmer
Re: Collision detection with Bone Animation? [Re: xXxGuitar511] #120094
04/01/07 13:29
04/01/07 13:29
Joined: Feb 2006
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mpdeveloper_B Offline
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mpdeveloper_B  Offline
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but the truth is games like Jedi Academy had this kind of collision, without building the model out of vertex attached (or bone attached) entities, but i guess comparing the modified quake engine to 3DGS is invalid


- aka Manslayer101

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