Grrrr! >:( Don't get me started on "Project Offset".

Short version: Waaaay back when they were just 'playing around', they asked for folks to help debug/test/play with it, give suggestions, etc. ...Time moves forward... They show some really nice stuff they have done. All their supporters/fans ask if it's still planned to be "free or very low, indie, hobbiest price". They reiterate that yes, it will be. One of the reasons they started it was to learn themselves and 'just play around'...because all the 'big name' engines were just too dang expensive. ...Jump ahead in time... Suddenly, they say, "Well, the price is going to be a bit more expensive, but that's 'cause of all the work we've put into it". (fans/supporters guestimate $1k - $2k). ...Fast forward again... "Oh, uh, sorry, we changed our minds. It's now gonna be a bazillion dollars. Thanks for your years of support, help, suggestions and all that. C'ya, loosers!"

Grrrr! Sorry, but I'm *still* bitter at that whole "changed our minds" switcharoo they did. Just ONCE I'd like to see a pair of excellent programmers "stick it to the big guys" by writing a UT3/ProjectOffset/CryEngine2 level game engine...and then make it FREE (or VERY low price...sub-$1000). Can you imagine the kick-ass looking games we would see? Can you imagine the sheer amount of unaldulterated new-game-ideas that would be popping out? Man...when I win my millions and millions, I'm gonna spend $3million developing a 'next-gen' game engine and sell it dirt cheap.

then again, people are spending so much of there life developing an engine, then i think they deserve to be paid a profressional price, and maybe at the begining they didnt realize it would become this big eventually

Project Offset does anger me , to just turn your back like that on their fellow indies just for some money , c'mon , they were still going to make millions with their game , what a bunch of money hungry panzies. Same thing with the other engine , the reality one , even though that one was pretty expensive as it was , but had indie licenses and the like that made it a good and possible option , and here came epic with some money and they gayed out in an instant. Thats why I love gamestudio , even though it might not be the Unreal 3 engine , it's a good engine and very affordable , which in turn gives us the oppportunity to make a game withought having to be rich. So yeah , a big [censored] you to the project offset team.

Hmm well there are some good points being made. It would be nice for a low-cost engine to be made available to indies. That is certainly true.

I can understand how it is frustrating for many people who have followed them to see them aiming thier toolset to more well-financed projects.

But there is also another side. The fact is developing a " true next-gen " engine is not as easy at may appear to some. It is actually pretty difficult. It requires significant knowledge and understanding of a myriad of subjects, details and nuances. It requires much thought and foresight.

For someone is developing such an engine, it is a very personal thing. Much time, thought and effort.

During this odyssey this dreamer-programmer must somehow pay for hardware / software , pay the bills ( if applicable ), go to school ( if applicable ), and finally live life.

They will work for months --- and yes even years --- with little to show.

Especially frustrating is finding that developing such an engine is not nearly have the battle. Engines power games. Even if an engine were to be developed, the game remains.

Developing a game requires even more resources ( i.e. such as money ) and time. It also requires a staff. Especially artists. Not just a lone programmer trying to make crude meshes.

The Project Offset team decided to go the tech demo route. Release some nice videos, polish the technlogy. Attract interest. Try to obtain a deal, a license that allows them to work full-time on their dream project.

They are people too. They need to pay the bills. They want to develop games just like you. They chose one path, it seems to be working for them.

Again its frustrating for other indies. to see one more engine that they might not be able to obtain. But its their work, their dream. Hehe now enough grumbling lets work on our own

Good for the PO to sell the engine for what it's probably worth. Any team, with a sane head on their shoulders, would do the same thing.

While i have no comment about the engine, i do think that the pricing is sensible, largely because "serious" developers often dismiss an engine or technology if it is inexpensive...silly huh?

...yet sooo true!

But still, nice screenies.

Another new screen, simply amazing !

I think the 2D straw doesn´t look so well. They use millions of polygones and such stuff is 2D... I don´t like it. MAybe personal taste. But in the best game I played in my life everything was 3D. I am talking about Vampire Bloodlines. I think there are no sprites in that game.

I dont understand why they wasted alot of polygones in that screenshot for the mouth of a beast and then made almost everything on his back just a flat texture... They screwed the rule for high detailed face and low detailed body, by exaggerating it.

This screen shot is a good example for, I want to watch it, but I dont want to play it.

Next to vampire bloodlines, the best games I know are games like: Super Metroid, Zelda III, Zelda Ocarina of Time, Yoshis Island, Super Mario World, Sonic Adventure, Actraiser, Gargoyles Quest (on snes), FinalFantasyIII, Rayman, BeyondGood and Evil...

and some other I can't remember right now (on NeoGeo are also alot of great games).

amazing, indeed.