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Re: MMO Programmer Position [Re: Volund] #143945
08/06/07 05:35
08/06/07 05:35
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 390
Florida
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oldschoolj Offline OP
Senior Member
oldschoolj  Offline OP
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 390
Florida
Wether or not this company does it, is not an issue. I don't have anyone to account for but myself. You have to focus on what is most important, or you find yourself getting hung up to much, and then nothing gets done on time.

If I pay this company 14k and they do what they say, then great.

If I pay them and they fail, I get refunded.

If they dont refund me, the game gets released, and I make my money back eventually.

If I dont pay anyone and I fail at mp programming, then the game still gets released, and I use the money I've made to make a second release that has mp enabled.

If I make the game and the mp myself, and all is successful, great.

If I make the game and the mp, and the game flops, I remake the game with or without the mp, and learn from my mistakes, and still make money.
Anyway you look at it I win, and the people who play the game win, because with or without multiplayer, its still gonna be a very fun game.

I honestly never did have much time to look at what might not happen. I only see the things that will happen if I choose to do it, and then make my next choise based on the results.




you can find me with my face in the keyboard, unshaven, listening to some nameless techno tragedy, and hashing through code over a cold cup a stale joe. __________________________________ yours truly
Re: MMO Programmer Position [Re: oldschoolj] #143946
08/09/07 13:16
08/09/07 13:16
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 652
Netherlands
bstudio Offline
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bstudio  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 652
Netherlands
$14000 eh... the problem is that if you even release your game you never know if you'll get it back through profit (that means after subtraction of the server costs etc. )


BASIC programmers never die, they GOSUB and don't RETURN.
Re: MMO Programmer Position [Re: bstudio] #143947
08/09/07 18:59
08/09/07 18:59
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,377
USofA
fastlane69 Offline
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fastlane69  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,377
USofA
Quote:

If I pay them and they fail, I get refunded.

If they dont refund me, the game gets released, and I make my money back eventually.




Be sure to specify with painful accuracy what your requirements are in terms of performance and stability. Failure is a subjective thing and I can tell you with almost 100% certainty that what you consider a failure they will not. One of the biggest problems in Software Engineering is poor requirements analysis at the begining of a project. Especially since you are asking them to develop this on such a short time-line, you might see them spend 1/3 of the time (one month) going in one direction and by the time you notice that it is wrong, it's too late or they will ask for more money or any number of other problems.

And the second line distresses me. What that implies is that you asked for a refund because the program wasn't what you wanted but was denied. Under that circumstance, you hope to release what you consider a failed product and still make your money back? That doesn't add up.

There are gaps in your business logic oldschooli and I hope you will engage me in dialogue to brace them up. I've seen your dedication to this project and no one can fault you for that but success doesn't happen overnight or in 3 months and slowing down and really understanding what you are doing is essential... trust me, after 5 years of doing what you want to do and wanting to do everything fast I found out that patience is the greatest skill towards making an MMO.

Re: MMO Programmer Position [Re: fastlane69] #143948
08/09/07 23:49
08/09/07 23:49
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 390
Florida
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oldschoolj Offline OP
Senior Member
oldschoolj  Offline OP
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 390
Florida
I'm honestly not worried about making a profit on the game. But I do appreciate your concern Fastlane. Which is why you should purchase a copy when it comes out. This way you'll be doing your small part to ensuring a successful release.


you can find me with my face in the keyboard, unshaven, listening to some nameless techno tragedy, and hashing through code over a cold cup a stale joe. __________________________________ yours truly
Re: MMO Programmer Position [Re: oldschoolj] #143949
08/17/07 20:09
08/17/07 20:09
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,856
TheExpert Offline
Senior Developer
TheExpert  Offline
Senior Developer

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,856
There is powerfull open source API solutin, racknet and others,
even more the mmorpg engine used for the frecnh mmorpg Ryzom
is open source , you could take it's Network API ?

Multiverse mmorpg engien is a good solution, in last position Torque Engine.

How many people doing your game ? have you 3D assets, 2D art to show ?
Will it be original ?

Well ... if i wanted to make an mmorpg , i would take the appropriate engine ,
and solution !

Re: MMO Programmer Position [Re: TheExpert] #143950
08/17/07 22:27
08/17/07 22:27
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,377
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fastlane69 Offline
Senior Expert
fastlane69  Offline
Senior Expert

Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,377
USofA
You're lucky, Oldschooli. There are many more legitimate options for MMO's today than in the past years. I would seriously look at the Multiverse engine if you want to do a typical Fantasy MMORPG. Raknet and other solutions are network API's and would require you to do a ton of programming to get it up and running. Torque has a MMO solution that isn't public yet (AFAIK) but like raknet, it will require very advanced C++ knowledge to get it up and running. 3DGS is a good engine to prototype and with time and money can be used for MMO but 99% of the community doesn't do MP so you are basically alone on your mission.

Lot's of options. It's up to you to decide which is best based on your resources but I envy you starting now and not 5 years ago like I did!

Re: MMO Programmer Position [Re: fastlane69] #143951
08/18/07 11:34
08/18/07 11:34
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,856
TheExpert Offline
Senior Developer
TheExpert  Offline
Senior Developer

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,856
For Torque :
new offer

You just need to buy arcane FX and Torque engine to use that free solution.

Well good luck , caus in indie domain there is not solid mmorpg/network
solutions.

I would also say , take directly multiverse.

(But if you don't have art,story, 3D assets,characters ... solid 3D artists with you , expect some years before doing something solid.)

A question what is your project target quality :
beginner, indie quality, commercial quality, professionnal AA or AAA ?

Re: MMO Programmer Position [Re: TheExpert] #143952
08/18/07 19:18
08/18/07 19:18
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,377
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fastlane69 Offline
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fastlane69  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,377
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Even in the AAA domain there is no solid MMO network solution. AAA usually has more resources (money and programmers) where that isn't as bg a deal but if they wanted to get an off the shelf solution, they are virtually in the same situation we are.

Re: MMO Programmer Position [Re: fastlane69] #143953
08/18/07 23:25
08/18/07 23:25
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,856
TheExpert Offline
Senior Developer
TheExpert  Offline
Senior Developer

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,856
indeed ahhahaa
Even Guild Wars and others mmo you play in regions servers !

So i think he can forget MMO , caus it's a difficult domain , why beginning
game making with the most difficult ?

Re: MMO Programmer Position [Re: TheExpert] #143954
08/20/07 03:57
08/20/07 03:57
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,377
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fastlane69 Offline
Senior Expert
fastlane69  Offline
Senior Expert

Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,377
USofA
Quote:

why beginning
game making with the most difficult




Your point is valid: the safest way to do an MMO would be to make several SP games first in order to understand the point of software design that are true for any type of game and then moving on to more difficult MP challenges and then MMO....

...but for some of us, MMO's are the only games that challenge us and we want to make. For people like us, there is no reason to waste time on anything but MMO and that is where we start and end.

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