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Re: A7 next gen workflow :
[Re: TheExpert]
#160859
10/19/07 19:19
10/19/07 19:19
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 7,490
Orange Brat
Senior Expert
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Senior Expert
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 7,490
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WED has worked fine for me for 8 years. I've watched it grow, and using the new concave on feature, you can build anything you want with it and everything will actually WORK and LOOK RIGHT without any import/export from 3rd party BS that can occur. It doesn't have all the modeler friendly tools, but an experienced user like myself can work around this and create nice curvy detailed levels when we're not burned out.  Would I like to have some modeler friendly stuff in there (MED type stuff)? Sure, and if there's not a The Future request then there should be, but I can live with what we have regardless. @Conitec, just don't scrap it. If people want to use a modeler, they can use Wings, Blender, or whatever other packages have FBX export. It's just a matter of getting those exporters to export something that looks like it should once in engine. Quote:
Feature wise, I think that OGRE is on the same line or ahead 3dgs. However, the tools are somewhat missing.
OGRE is a rendering engine, not a game engine. There is a game engine that uses it that can be found if you search their site, but it's 3rd party.
My User Contributions master list - my initial post links are down but scroll down page to find list to active links
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Re: A7 next gen workflow :
[Re: Orange Brat]
#160860
10/20/07 18:22
10/20/07 18:22
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Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,924
Finland
Ambassador
Serious User
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Serious User
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,924
Finland
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Quote:
Quote:
Feature wise, I think that OGRE is on the same line or ahead 3dgs. However, the tools are somewhat missing.
OGRE is a rendering engine, not a game engine. There is a game engine that uses it that can be found if you search their site, but it's 3rd party.
Oh yeah, sorry. I'm a cpp developer myself so for me it comes without saying that you can get the libs and other stuff to make OGRE a game engine yourself. But most of the guys here arent cpp developers! Argh!
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Re: A7 next gen workflow :
[Re: Ambassador]
#160861
11/06/07 12:00
11/06/07 12:00
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 71
central US
yung
Junior Member
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Junior Member
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 71
central US
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@ Conitec \ OrangeBrat: No offense intended, when I said "scrapping WED/MED", I meant as the solution to an integrated all-in-one game-creation tool. I think someone needs to focus development efforts toward tools that are executed at runtime using the A5/6/7 engine, like small plugin GUI's that serve a specific game-design purpose. For instance, a radar-hud "MAKER", where the tool has a large possible range of styles, and totally unique things can be made from the basic set of elements. Some more examples include: Physics Creator Menu Creator Terrain Creator Sky Creator LenseFlare Maker  CutScene Creator (RealTime-ScriptDriven cutscenes) These things I myself think would greatly increase the workflow capabilties of GameStudio. Feedback on this concept is encouraged.
' The One '
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Re: A7 next gen workflow :
[Re: yung]
#160863
11/06/07 17:15
11/06/07 17:15
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,377
USofA
fastlane69
Senior Expert
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Senior Expert
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,377
USofA
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There is already "gameedit" which allows for a lot of realtime level development. It's pretty close to being released offcially from what I can see. There is work on a menu editor. I don't know what it's state of development is but it's in the works by a forum member As far as your other suggestions, a physics, sky, and lensflare creator make no sense. Physics is a purely programming application ad sky and lensflare are just textures. I have no idea what a cutscene creator would look like... maybe like MS moviemaker? But that would only be useful if you wanted to make movies with 3DGS and if you are making games, I just don't see a good implementation of this. So as you can see, most of what you want is already in the works! 
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Re: A7 next gen workflow :
[Re: fastlane69]
#160864
11/06/07 17:47
11/06/07 17:47
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 6,904
HeelX
Senior Expert
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Senior Expert
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 6,904
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Quote:
I have no idea what a cutscene creator would look like... maybe like MS moviemaker? But that would only be useful if you wanted to make movies with 3DGS and if you are making games, I just don't see a good implementation of this.
You take a scene and animate it with key frames.. between those, objects get interpolated. E.g. you can set splines where characters walk along, you can set animation cycles on key frames, set bone key frames, set certain particle emitters on that.. like a timeline. Just ideas..
Its much work, its not senseless and its doable. It just requires provided materials, a requirements specification (we speak in terms of software engineering and not about the typical game developer's trial-and-error project approach), research, time and money.
Last edited by HeelX; 11/06/07 17:48.
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Re: A7 next gen workflow :
[Re: HeelX]
#160865
11/06/07 23:42
11/06/07 23:42
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,377
USofA
fastlane69
Senior Expert
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Senior Expert
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,377
USofA
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Quote:
You take a scene and animate it with key frames.. between those, objects get interpolated. E.g. you can set splines where characters walk along, you can set animation cycles on key frames, set bone key frames, set certain particle emitters on that.. like a timeline. Just ideas..
I was thinking of the traditional AVI cutscenes but even using in-game elements, I don't see how you could create an application that would make this more efficient.
And trying to make an application that would effectively couple to the multitudes of ways that people make their games sounds counter-productive... you either have to modify your code to the Cutscene creator standard or you "tweak" the Cutscene generator to fit your code.
And after all, the creator you describe sounds just like different settings within the game... setting paths and bones and particles, isn't that what 3DGS is for after all? Sounds a lot easier to just disable all player control and then just program the cutscene yourself.
Doable? Yeah, but in the same way that TUSC is doable! 
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Re: A7 next gen workflow :
[Re: fastlane69]
#160866
11/07/07 08:23
11/07/07 08:23
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,121
Potsdam, Brandenburg, Germany
Machinery_Frank
Senior Expert
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Senior Expert
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,121
Potsdam, Brandenburg, Germany
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No. If you want to make an intense game with tons of cut-scenes then you have no chance to program them all yourself. A cut-scene editor is a very nice idea.
You never can imagine all the states of coordinates, rotates and animation states in your mind to program them in the background. It is way more convenient if you can change positions, rotation, animation states, sound files, particles and camera with an editor and a few panels.
Models, Textures and Games from Dexsoft
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Re: A7 next gen workflow :
[Re: Machinery_Frank]
#160867
11/07/07 14:08
11/07/07 14:08
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 6,904
HeelX
Senior Expert
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Senior Expert
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 6,904
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The problem is, that cutscenes require lots of data. Personally, I don't want to set them in WED or so.. because its too much unnecessary data binded in a level files. So I would have to load paths, timetables, scripts, ressources etc. during runtime - seperated from the WMP file. Plus, a realtime 3D editor with a preview function would be invaluable to artists. TUSC failed for several reasons, especially caused by an "open end feature list". A cutscene editor would require indeed a specific interface for the game (in the meaning of accessing the editor and embedding cutscenes), but that could be simplified. All the rest is conventional software engineering with a fixed number of specific features. I don't know why you are kidding
Last edited by HeelX; 11/07/07 14:10.
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Re: A7 next gen workflow :
[Re: HeelX]
#160868
11/07/07 14:29
11/07/07 14:29
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,121
Potsdam, Brandenburg, Germany
Machinery_Frank
Senior Expert
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Senior Expert
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,121
Potsdam, Brandenburg, Germany
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Yes. I also think that this is doable. I think it just should store the following data in a time-table (for objects like models, sprites, camera and lights):
Following values could be interpolated between key frames:
- position
- scale
- rotation
- light color, intensity
Following values cannot be interpolated but activated:
- animation state
- name of a function / action to start (particle, script)
- material, texture to change
A timed player could start all those later in the game via function / action.
Models, Textures and Games from Dexsoft
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