Absolutely agree. It will be hard to get a job based on C or Lite-C skills.

I scan job offers often and I realized that they more often now look for Java programmers than C++. But both are a good base to get jobs.

Java programmers is hot because of those Web and enterprise applications.
For game development I can't see Java is really matter, unless your target is Mobile gaming.
I am considering .net language like C# is becoming more and more important now.

I used to believe that C# will become imp for game dev but I think there is still a lot of legacy code for 3d games in C++...so I think tis still safe to make games in C++...also remember that C# games wont run on other than MS platforms

unity3d uses C# and it runs on OSX.

in my opinion the biggest disadvantage of C4 is that it doesn't come with support for a scripting language like unity3d or gamestudio. the node based C4 scripting is so limited that i wouldn't call it scripting.

it's not that i would be totally unable to use C++ (i have some C++ experience) but C++ is an ugly language and no fun to work with. the performance of C++ isn't needed for most gameplay code so why should i use C++ instead of a scripting language.

I absolutely agree with you.

But my view changed in the last years. I dont like C++ and I always talked similiar like you about it. But now I came to a point where I realized that my customers or publishers and distributers will not ask me if I feel comfortable with my scripting language. They just want to see the result. And when it looks bad, renders slow and has no shadows then my project does not get a second glance. The only thing that matters is the result.

So I am open now for new challenges, new languages and new technologies to reach the highest goal with my limited budget. I will not give up just because I dont like a certain programming language.

this should be moved to tools.

C4 sounds good for artists, and it sounds generally better than most editions of A7, but the lack of a good programming language puts programmers at a disadvantage.

i know programmers can give it a good go with C++, but lite-C with SED puts A7 at an advantage for programmers (especially amateur programmers, but also for advanced programmers).

so the question to MaxF, the thread starter, is: are you a programmer or artist, primarily?

julz

sorry i wasn't so explicit, but i meant an integrated programming language. i assumed that it doesn't come with a C++ compiler but is (relatively) easy to extend via C++. either way lite-C is easier to use and almost as powerful, and very well integrated into A7.

i thought that would've been clear enough from the sentence after the one you quoted.

Quote:

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But probably you confused programmers with scripters here.

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no.

even "real" programmers, if they were willing to get their hands into lite-C (which is almost easier done than said) would much prefer to use SED and lite-C than using an SDK unless it was really necessary.

julz

I disagree. As long as SED crashes with debug information and error messages are not handled back to SED you will not feel as comfortable as you feel in a standard development environment.
And dont forget the long compiling times of projects like GameEdit or bigger games. Some projects compiled 20 minutes for a Lite-C script.

Are you familiar with other programming languages? If yes, then you know the difference yourself.

lite-C is very young, and I bet the long compile time and SED problem will be overcome, otherwise Conitec will out of the game development tools business as this market is getting tougher and tougher.

I firmly believe that for small team, the flexibility and power of scripting language is crucial, you can even use lite-C to write OpenGL and DirectX apps., but still easy to use in C-script style. Other those LUA or Javascript base scripting system can't compete with it. I trend to left those complicated(time consuming) C++ thing for engine developer.

Of course if you have a bigger team and very concrete team role, you may have full time C++ programmer dedicate in game and engine programming, if so A7 maybe never got your attention I think.

BTW I've bought a license of C4 before they raise the price to $200.