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Re: Why We Love and Hate the 3DGS Engine... [Re: the_clown] #270287
06/07/09 12:54
06/07/09 12:54
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 258
Chicago
J
Jaeger Offline
Member
Jaeger  Offline
Member
J

Joined: May 2009
Posts: 258
Chicago
Hope this isn't too old. :P Still wanted to comment though:

Love:


*Lite-C... It's a wonderful language, and perfect for getting things done in reasonable amounts of time. You can make apps in Lite-C, and your users will think it's done in C or C++. It's one of the most powerful, compact languages I've yet to see.

*The community! I don't know where I'd be without all the friendly folks here. I'm not a n00b to programming, but I just started with Lite-C. I think I'm on the brink of mastering the syntax and all of the language's nuances, thanks to your help. With the workshops and these forums, learning Lite-C is a breeze! <3

*The flexibility of the engine, and how such a cheap (compared to others) engine can give you the power to *potentially* compete with top game dev companies with the right people on your team and enough experience.

I've actually seen some silly people look at simple games made with the templates or by n00b users, and say "Ew... This engine doesn't have very good graphics!", which is utter nonsense. The engine doesn't have graphics, because the user is who makes them! smile If you use cheesy models and skins, your game will look cheesy and cheap. If you have excellent, professional looking artwork, you can make graphics that rival today's top titles. You only get out what you put in! Poo in, poo out; Excellence in, excellence out!

Hate:

*C-script! Ugh! >:(

*When people say "Help! I need some code to make a <fill in blank> game!"

*I also hate the name "3D Gamestudio". I think it undermines the power and flexibility of the engine, and makes it sound like a kiddy toy. It also bothers me how it is advertised as being so "easy" and "simple". It's almost like they're saying: "Gamestudio: So easy a caveman could do it!" or "Gamestudio: Two clicks, and you've just made WoW II!" Lol! I actually saw a forum once where someone posted the 3DGS ad from the main site, and there were actually people saying "Oh cool! I think I'm going to get this Pro version for my kid's birthday. He turns 8 next month, and he will love this!" <- Boy, will that guy's kid be disappointed... (That's a true story, honestly.)

*I also hate the name "SED" or "Script Editor". I don't think it's appropriate for A7. It was probably great for old versions, when C-script was the way of life, but I think it needs to be changed to "CED" (Code Editor) or something better. It's not just for simple scripting, after all...

*MED... Maybe I'm just no good with it, but it seems that it can't do decent UV mapping at all. If I choose "Atlas Mapping", it looks like the model is unwrapped, and then torn to shreds like a bad dog does to a newspaper. I can't build crap with it either. I also use Wings3D when I need to make a model on my own. But I usually leave modeling to my artists, because I suck, lol. It also seems that you can't really "fine tune" the position of objects, vertices, bones like I want to. Even with snapping turned off, it still snaps a little bit, and always out of line with the place I want it. The only thing I use it for is applying skins to a mesh that's already UV mapped, and doing animations/adding bones. But, if we could combine the pros of MED and Wings3D, I think it would be a awesome modeling app for what its worth. Ooh... Did I mention I hate how you have to select things in MED? Lol, it's a major pain, and far too tricky...

*And finally, I hate how there are so many (needless, imho) restrictions on all the great programmers out there who can't afford Pro! Mainly, things like surpressing the startup window. I know Conitec has to pay their bills and feed their families, but still... I'm glad I can surpress it, but I think it kinda ruins a lot of good projects for people who don't own Pro. It's like they force you to advertise for them if you only own Commercial or lower, and it makes your game look less professional and independent. I think there should also be a simple, straightforward resource editor to give your exe's unique icons, rather than magic copy n' paste tricks with a resource hacker. :S It's really a HUGE jump in price from Comm to Pro, just to do a few little things like hide the window, among others. It's also kind of annoying how it says "Compiling Main.exe..........." if you don't hide the window for a published project.

Not really ranting, just dreaming out loud and making suggestions. I do hope Conitec actually reads these! smile

______________________________________________________________
P.S. @ clown - A gun has never killed anyone. It's always been a person who either mishandled a gun, or intentionally used it to kill. So it's really people who kill people. smile

Re: Why We Love and Hate the 3DGS Engine... [Re: Jaeger] #270340
06/07/09 19:31
06/07/09 19:31
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,177
Netherlands
PHeMoX Offline
Senior Expert
PHeMoX  Offline
Senior Expert

Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,177
Netherlands
Quote:
But, if we could combine the pros of MED and Wings3D, I think it would be a awesome modeling app for what its worth. Ooh... Did I mention I hate how you have to select things in MED? Lol, it's a major pain, and far too tricky...


It's why I use Wings3D instead of MED, because except for skinning not too complex models, it's pretty much a disaster. I do use it for bone animation, but that's because there isn't a better alternative. It's because I need MED bones in my models and 3DMAX is not an option. smile

I have to admit though, I haven't done any research into modeling applications since the first days of A6 or so.

Quote:
*And finally, I hate how there are so many (needless, imho) restrictions on all the great programmers out there who can't afford Pro!


I also feel very restricted in not being able to drive in a Ferrari. Very frustrating. wink

Doesn't mean Ferrari should lower the price just to make me happy.

Of course, whether the difference in price is worth it or justified is somewhat of a different topic, but if you want it, you'll have to buy it.


PHeMoX, Innervision Software (c) 1995-2008

For more info visit: Innervision Software
Re: Why We Love and Hate the 3DGS Engine... [Re: PHeMoX] #270360
06/07/09 21:05
06/07/09 21:05
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 298
Southern Oceans
KiwiBoy Offline
Member
KiwiBoy  Offline
Member

Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 298
Southern Oceans
1. Well now, I actually am used to MED, WED now so its no bother to build worlds and models of the quality I want and thats good.
2. I love the mesh bubild mode laugh
3. The community where some one, some where, sometimes will help or solve hard probs with me for me or care enough to correct my mistakes.
4. AUMS...yeah baby!
5. GED looming on the horizon...yeah baby too!
6. The discussions
7. The fact I have a fully capable working application suite.

on the other hand....
1. Hate that Wed is only pertinant to Pro version, thats like giving me a lolly and saying I can only have 2 licks.
2. Block build mode is too tricky
3. Where are the experts who like to help???
4. Need em bimonthly
5. GED's not here yet
6. Subjects need more sophistication, its all to 'school child' like for me.
7. The fact that I have to learn programming to get it working for me.

So wheres the online school around here?


Use the 'manual' Luke, the manual is your friend. 'Self reminder' smile

My WebPage
Re: Why We Love and Hate the 3DGS Engine... [Re: KiwiBoy] #270426
06/08/09 10:03
06/08/09 10:03
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,177
Netherlands
PHeMoX Offline
Senior Expert
PHeMoX  Offline
Senior Expert

Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,177
Netherlands
Love- Oh yeah, lets not forget indeed, the AUM magazines are awesome.

Hate- When I run out of coffee, cola or redbull ??

"3. Where are the experts who like to help???"

Time is money, knowledge is valuable.. the same old same old. That's why some are too busy, but it doesn't mean there aren't any that do like to help.

Last edited by PHeMoX; 06/08/09 10:05.

PHeMoX, Innervision Software (c) 1995-2008

For more info visit: Innervision Software
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