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Re: Leaving 3DGS : [Re: Error014] #418982
03/04/13 08:42
03/04/13 08:42
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,225
germany
gri Offline
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Happy Birthday gri  Offline
Serious User

Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,225
germany
ratchet,

I wish you create a nice game with another engine.

But I have big doubts about. Either somebody can do at least a demo with one tool. Or hunts his whole life behind the perfect engine. And do nothing other than engine comparasion.

So go with the flow. You can check in here at any time.

best wishes,
gri


"Make a great game or kill it early" (Bruce Shelley, Ensemble Studios)
Re: Leaving 3DGS : [Re: gri] #418996
03/04/13 13:48
03/04/13 13:48
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,488
ratchet Offline OP
Expert
ratchet  Offline OP
Expert

Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,488
Thanks Gri.

Yes perhaps i'll never make a game LOL laugh
I'm more participating to making a game in teams as 3D artist.

For a personnal game, we'll see, but at least i just can prototype , sculpt terrain, paint grass, code simple stuff with non comparable workflow.
As more 3D artist i don't seek programming engine, so i have lot more pelasure using Unity and some other engine workflow laugh
Why should i keep working with so out dated workflow when there are other lot more best and that gives me fun ?

I don't seek the prefect engine, there is no perfect, for little games a lot can do it. It's simpley i think i spend too muc time and find too much stuck with MED and WED, really.
I wanted terrain editor for long time in WED as complete as other engines, it never comed, so now i just thaught, ok let's stop dreaming and catch something having the tools and workflow i want.

But i don't even have lot of time for 3D game making also.
Could it be 3D models testing, protyping, code testing or game making i prefer to do that in today tools.

Good luck with your projects also laugh
(hope to see a good game from you also)

Re: Leaving 3DGS : [Re: ratchet] #418999
03/04/13 14:04
03/04/13 14:04
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,816
at my pc (duh)
darkinferno Offline
Serious User
darkinferno  Offline
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,816
at my pc (duh)
Well ratchet if you ever want to support a team, you can drop me a pm, current project: http://www.youtube.com/user/teamINOV?feature=mhee

Re: Leaving 3DGS : [Re: darkinferno] #419007
03/04/13 15:58
03/04/13 15:58
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,488
ratchet Offline OP
Expert
ratchet  Offline OP
Expert

Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,488
Great game Darkinferno.

The HUD are great, graphics and gameplay are just fine.
I remember your first 3DGS shooters videos was great.
How much time you lived 3DGS ? (i should had followed long time ago)

And find that demo video better in effects :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwLI8pXlJCA&list=UUDXoUsDWQqEyMs_2X6ijBng

Did you use terrain ? Unity free version ? What system did you use as GUI ?


I'm really buzy in real life and already in some teams projects for the 3D art.
But i'll find some time to make some stuff for your game i hope laugh



Last edited by ratchet; 03/04/13 16:05.
Re: Leaving 3DGS : [Re: ratchet] #419161
03/07/13 10:44
03/07/13 10:44
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,816
at my pc (duh)
darkinferno Offline
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darkinferno  Offline
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,816
at my pc (duh)
Everything is unity free and no extensions are used, GUI is written by me.

As for the effects, yes they may be better but they were slower on FPS.

Goodluck with your projects also

Re: Leaving 3DGS : [Re: ratchet] #419187
03/07/13 16:14
03/07/13 16:14
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,771
Bay City, MI
lostclimate Offline
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lostclimate  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,771
Bay City, MI
Originally Posted By: ratchet


Actually when the goal is making a game, not programming shaders or tools, i think 3DGS is not the best choice.Specially if you are not programmer.


not to sound contradictory to what your trying to say, but in game development... programming is necessary. Unless you want a cookie cutter game made with the same templates everyone else uses your going to need to:
A - Learn to program and be a lone wolf with a small project
B - Look for a programmer willing to help you compensation or not or whatever you work out
C - Hop on a team as an artist that already has a programmer

There is no way around it.

EDIT: outside of all that, I wish you the best of luck in wherever you decide to go with it.

Last edited by lostclimate; 03/07/13 16:15.
Re: Leaving 3DGS : [Re: lostclimate] #419198
03/07/13 19:14
03/07/13 19:14
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,488
ratchet Offline OP
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ratchet  Offline OP
Expert

Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,488
@LosticMate :
I have teams projects just as 3D artist for 3D assets.
I have one personnal small mobile game i want to make also, can't be done with 3DGS, with other engine i can do ti and test it on my Nexus tablet as i progress.

-----------------------

Stop beeing so closed mind.

The author made the great game with Unity and Playmaker no programming at all.
Xenpid Maze

playmaker for Unity

There is also U-script or Kismet for UDK.

Yes by programming i will have to do some, but only gameplay and AI, i won't code terrain tools as i need them, or shader editor, particle editor, Gui editor, Navigation system , complete character controllers , and camera systems etc ...
Some indie Engines give you all that that even more :
-Android
-IOS
-Flash
-Engine Web player
-Windows mobile
-Mac
-Linux
-consoles (license needed)


Sorry, but 3DGS even on showcase we don't see lot of finished games or games. Go to Unity Showcase and see the difference.
Android will come , but you won't have IOS , multi platform, advanced graphic features, unified lightening and shader tools etc ...

Lot of people using 3DGS don't target a game, that's totally different hobby and use from people goals is making a real game believe me, the hard work will be lot more in 3D assets making, level design , pure gameplay programming (visual also) than Tools coding , graphic coding or simply toying.


Even Lite-C is too much C like instead of C#or Javascript like, initializations are a nightmare.
I'm not convincing you, if you don't see 3DGS is really behind a good bunhc of others (UDK, Unity, Essenthel 2 , Shiva 2, LeadWerks 3, C4 Engine etc ...)

Some of these engines proposes you ready to use Navigation level based on geometry like some RayCast by calling a simple command.
Yes 3DGS is really behind.



We don't see people making games a lot here , but we see a lot programming features or tools.
it's not the best place for 3D artists having some basic programming knowledge.


If i would go UDK, just don't compared it in terms of tools and advanced graphics and unified lightening, don't tell me 3DGS is better ?

My goal is publish a real game on mobile could it be little or bad, so i choosen the rigth engine, i won't wait end of the year for 3DGS android, and it will always lack 3D tools (shader editor, particle editor, terrain editor etc ... compared ot other engines).


Just to resume for me like some others that have left 3DGS, we've just different goals than programming and others just needed other features and tools that don't exists with 3DGS.

It's not complicated to understand laugh


Good luck with your projects also.

Last edited by ratchet; 03/07/13 19:25.
Re: Leaving 3DGS : [Re: lostclimate] #419200
03/07/13 19:18
03/07/13 19:18
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 3,751
Canada
WretchedSid Offline
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WretchedSid  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 3,751
Canada
I have to agree with Lostclimate. Being able to program is crucial for building the logic of your game, otherwise you are just limiting yourself and your game to what ships by default. Now, that doesn't mean that you can make a game just because you can program, because graphics and sound are just as important as the logic of your game.

You can do all this on your own, if you have at least a basic skill set in each of the disciplines required to make a game, but chances are that you will always depend on someone else because it's more or less impossible to do everything on your own.

Quote:
Even Lite-C is too much C like instead of C#or Javascript like, initializations are a nightmare.

No language is perfect ratchet. You can tell me whatever you may want, but no language is. A language is a tool, and just like you don't use a crowbar to toast your bread in the morning, no language fits each and every possible aspect. Sure, you can program a Jabber server in C just fine, but when you think about it, Erlang is much better suited for the task.
Now, think about C what you want, but it has its advantages, otherwise it wouldn't exist anymore (just like Perl is fading out because there are much better alternatives). Look at the Tiobe index, C is far from being dead, just fucking deal with it.

Quote:
it's not the best place for 3D artists having some basic programming knowledge.

Sorry, but looking at your posts and what you write, I'm afraid that you lack even the basics of programming (just like some other self proclaimed artists here). This is ultimately going to limit yourself, because you make yourself dependent to the default set of the tools at your hand. If that's good enough for you, fine, but please stop complaining if a tool offers you more, because there are people who don't want to be dependent on others.

Last edited by JustSid; 03/07/13 19:22.

Shitlord by trade and passion. Graphics programmer at Laminar Research.
I write blog posts at feresignum.com
Re: Leaving 3DGS : [Re: ratchet] #419206
03/07/13 20:24
03/07/13 20:24
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,771
Bay City, MI
lostclimate Offline
Expert
lostclimate  Offline
Expert

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,771
Bay City, MI
Originally Posted By: ratchet
@LosticMate :
I have teams projects just as 3D artist for 3D assets.
I have one personnal small mobile game i want to make also, can't be done with 3DGS, with other engine i can do ti and test it on my Nexus tablet as i progress.

-----------------------

Stop beeing so closed mind.

The author made the great game with Unity and Playmaker no programming at all.
Xenpid Maze

playmaker for Unity

There is also U-script or Kismet for UDK.

Yes by programming i will have to do some, but only gameplay and AI, i won't code terrain tools as i need them, or shader editor, particle editor, Gui editor, Navigation system , complete character controllers , and camera systems etc ...
Some indie Engines give you all that that even more :
-Android
-IOS
-Flash
-Engine Web player
-Windows mobile
-Mac
-Linux
-consoles (license needed)


Sorry, but 3DGS even on showcase we don't see lot of finished games or games. Go to Unity Showcase and see the difference.
Android will come , but you won't have IOS , multi platform, advanced graphic features, unified lightening and shader tools etc ...

Lot of people using 3DGS don't target a game, that's totally different hobby and use from people goals is making a real game believe me, the hard work will be lot more in 3D assets making, level design , pure gameplay programming (visual also) than Tools coding , graphic coding or simply toying.


Even Lite-C is too much C like instead of C#or Javascript like, initializations are a nightmare.
I'm not convincing you, if you don't see 3DGS is really behind a good bunhc of others (UDK, Unity, Essenthel 2 , Shiva 2, LeadWerks 3, C4 Engine etc ...)

Some of these engines proposes you ready to use Navigation level based on geometry like some RayCast by calling a simple command.
Yes 3DGS is really behind.



We don't see people making games a lot here , but we see a lot programming features or tools.
it's not the best place for 3D artists having some basic programming knowledge.


If i would go UDK, just don't compared it in terms of tools and advanced graphics and unified lightening, don't tell me 3DGS is better ?

My goal is publish a real game on mobile could it be little or bad, so i choosen the rigth engine, i won't wait end of the year for 3DGS android, and it will always lack 3D tools (shader editor, particle editor, terrain editor etc ... compared ot other engines).


Just to resume for me like some others that have left 3DGS, we've just different goals than programming and others just needed other features and tools that don't exists with 3DGS.

It's not complicated to understand laugh


Good luck with your projects also.


Im not being closed minded. acknex could do A LOT to catch up with those engines, but my point being, is that if you want to make a full fledged game with anything unique in it, programming will need to be done. and as justsid pointed out, c is a tool just as javascript is. infact I prefer lite-c to javascript right now, quite frankly I was not impressed with programming in javascript with unity last time i tested it (a couple years ago, granted) not that unity is particularly bad because of it, just not my flavor. my point is not of comparison but i mere observation that games take programming. yes, you can make a point and click game, but you will always be severely limited in what you can do with that type of creation plan.

Re: Leaving 3DGS : [Re: lostclimate] #419213
03/07/13 21:10
03/07/13 21:10
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 5,210
İstanbul, Turkey
Quad Offline
Senior Expert
Quad  Offline
Senior Expert

Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 5,210
İstanbul, Turkey
tl;dr; but just to add
kismet and playmaker counts as programming, imho.

once you got the algorithms in place on paper, realizing it in kismet or c or some other language is same thing.


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