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I think sex before marriage is profane


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I think of it as exercise and preview, because to be honest I'd hate divorce probably as much as you do.

On the more serious side though, sex should be something special between lovers, so ideally no one-night stands, still nobody's perfect I guess,

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Right, well the reason I think its profane is because I think that sex is literally getting to know someone the best you can ever possibly know someone on earth(except possibly being contained in someones womb). When you have sex with someone, you are seeing them closer, seeing them more intimately than any other way. So you are actually going into their "sacred" areas(if you will allow me to use the word "sacred" to apply to humans). So to see, know and feel someone that close, and then to walk away from them without the lasting committment of lifelong marriage to me is to committ a tresspassing on "sacred" ground. Thats why I consider it profane if it is outside the confines of marriage.

Before I was a Christian I had sex before marriage, but I regret it because they take a peice of me with them wherever they go, and I take a "piece" of them. I think sex is to "become one" with another, then when you walk away from that person you are tearing the bond apart. It is profane.

Even if you "think" you are in love. However people dont realize that true love will stay and committ, it is not only when you have "nice feelings" about someone. True lovers committ to each other and will stay together even when things become very difficult.

I am glad I have been married for 13 years, and I am happier every year.

As I said I wouldnt hate someone because they have sex before marriage, but I think it is destructive. And I think that you could find yourself in a situation where you no longer even know what love is, which is a tragic situation.

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Which I agree with 100%. However, if you say you care about Jesus, how can you hate other Christians? Especially since Jesus is supposed to be living in the hearts of those who believe? Im not saying your a hater, Im not saying anyone is, but if you more concerned whether someone in the world is gonna get their toes stepped on because you live a good life, are you going to change your ways just to make them happy? If Im trying to let people know the love of Christ is for those who have abortions should I have my wife have an abortion just so that I can show them that I can relate? Or should I all of a sudden say that abortion is ok because I dont want to hurt anyone's feelings? I dont believe so, I believe abortion is murder, I will never stop beliveing that, I would always call a spade a spade. I think homosexuality is perverse, I think sex before marriage is profane, I think alcohol is a killer, I think some swearing is blasphemous, and the list goes on. Do I hate you if you do something which is a sim against the Bible? No. But I will never say that these things are ok just because "I dont want to judge" , if I did that it would be a compromise and one thing the world does not need to see is more Christians make compromises, thats my two cents.

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I don't disagree with much of anything here. I don't think anyone should sin for the sake of being able to relate; and I don't do so. However, I've been through a lot of crap in life, and I can either choose to forget about it, or I can use it to help me understand others and be there for them when they need someone to talk to.

Here's an example on what I mean about some of these things: Take swearing. It's a collection of words that are considered "curses" in our language. But they also have other meanings. You can use the words without sin, but you can also use them sinfully. As a metaphor, think about a chair (as language). I can use it how it was intended, and sit on it. Or I can stand on it to use it for a stool even, not it's original design intent, but I don't sin by doing either. Now, I can take the chair and hit you with it- that is sin. Likewise, I can say that I am sitting on my ass being a forumrat for a while today. Not sinning. But if I go and say you're an ass hole, I am sinning (no worries, I don't think anything of the sort of you.. for metaphorical purposes only ). I chose not to elaborate on this to avoid having to elaborate my post into several pages . Some people are offended by just the word, so I try to not use those words at all around them or people I'm unsure about. But around those I know are not bothered by it, and I know their consciences aren't defiled or weakened by it (see Paul's "meat offered to sacrafices" writing, can't remember where), I don't hold my tongue. I look at things in morality by finding where the real problem is, it's the curse, not the word. A curse is not a word, it is an ill-meant utterance, but the English language has made the two very synonymous.

I never said I hated Christians, I said I disagreed with some of what they commonly believe and do. There is a difference between "judging" and "discerning." Judging is making a conclusion about someone by their actions- discerning is being able to recognize that the action itself is right or wrong. I'm not going to call out a person for doing something wrong if it isn't hurting anyone, because it is only going to cause resentment, it will not be received as it is intended. If they are hurting another person through their action, I will likely call it out in attempt to stop it, not in attempt to save them from their own action. I can't save them from their own action, much less convince them it is wrong unless they believe in morality on an equal footing. If I can argue it without the bible, I may attempt to convince them, but if it requires belief in an absolute moral system- it's a waste of time to try. For example, there is no way to convince someone that sex before marriage is wrong without using the
Bible. You can say it is unfair to potential future people they may share sex with, but then they can refute and say what it is days before a wedding with thier betrothed? The commitment of marriage is more certain than the possibility of divorce throwing it back into the same problem- another future partner. You're left without a concrete defense without the morals set forth in the Bible. Even in the Bible, there are many ways to argue exceptions and more depending on how your interpret things- but if the other person also has a footing in the Bible, there is a way to convince them that it is wrong.
EDIT: in addition to the sex before marriage after your last post.. you say "sacred" and that illustrates my point. What if the person doesn't believe it is "sacred" or that you "become one" with the other person? If they don't believe that, how do you convince them when you are looking at it from two completely different worldviews? You can't.

This is just me elaborating on some things you mentioned showing you what I mean further behind my words.

EDIT: also realize that a lot of what I say above is in response, although if standalone I would probably put things differently (or not bother at all... lol). Trying not to open a whole new can of worms

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I'm not going to call out a person for doing something wrong if it isn't hurting anyone, because it is only going to cause resentment, it will not be received as it is intended. If they are hurting another person through their action, I will likely call it out in attempt to stop it, not in attempt to save them from their own action. I can't save them from their own action, much less convince them it is wrong unless they believe in morality on an equal footing. If I can argue it without the bible, I may attempt to convince them, but if it requires belief in an absolute moral system- it's a waste of time to try. For example, there is no way to convince someone that sex before marriage is wrong without using the
Bible

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I understand your point. You cant really convince anyone of anything, and I dont try, Im not talking about just going up to people and preaching at them. It never happens that way. For me I keep quiet untill someone insists on talking about it. They have some kind of leftist liberal political opinion or some opinion about Christians and they start blabbing it out at work or school or something. Well since last time I checked I was in America I think I have just as much a right to offer my humble opinion as they do.

So yeah, I understand what you mean that Christians shouldnt just go around approaching people telling them that they are going to hell, but in all my years I have rarely EVER seen a Christian that behaves so badly. The vast majority of this usually occurs when some one brings up the subject at work or on_a_forum, then guess what? There is such thing as free speech, and all Im saying is that Christians can say what they want, and they dont have to water down their beliefs or refuse to say them just because they think the world might dissapprove.

But Im really happy about what your saying and I agree with you probably 98% of it. You have to remeber that I have seen you personally progress from a tight fisted conservative Christian to a liberal rebellious Christian and now you seem to be finding some middle ground, which I think is great. And of course we all have a lot of respect for you intelligence and programming skills. So I was a little worried about the possibility that you might have hung around NArdulus too long. LOL.

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As I said I wouldnt hate someone because they have sex before marriage, but I think it is destructive. And I think that you could find yourself in a situation where you no longer even know what love is, which is a tragic situation.

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So yeah, I understand what you mean that Christians shouldnt just go around approaching people telling them that they are going to hell, but in all my years I have rarely EVER seen a Christian that behaves so badly. The vast majority of this usually occurs when some one brings up the subject at work or on_a_forum, then guess what? There is such thing as free speech, and all Im saying is that Christians can say what they want, and they dont have to water down their beliefs or refuse to say them just because they think the world might dissapprove.

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I think that sex before marriage is a must. and the funny thing is, because of the exact reasons posted above.
To be able to share a happy marriage you will have to "know" the person as good as you can.
and since sex is the most intimate situation you can get in with another person (or more ) you will have to take the step first to be able to judge right. anything else would be just guessing, if you are honest.

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i also disagree with the statement that sex before marriage make you leave and lose some of yourself every time.

Imagine meeting a stranger and having a good conversation. something as personal as sex for example can be.
this, like sex, can enchance your life dramaticly if you allow it. it doesnt take away somthing from you but adds lots to your life.

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Okey, but a conversation with a stranger doesn't quite cover it, perhaps unless you'll have sex right after just meeting your new girlfriend off course ... I don't know, but I normally get to know my girlfriends first, lol. By the way, you've got to admit you more or less get 'exposed' when having sex, so you do 'lose' something I think.

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you can decide not to have sex, drink or eat lemons before your marriage. if this is what you want nobody should have anything against it or say anything against it.

but it also wont make your marriage better because of that or more honest or true.

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Very true, but it's about feelings, the emotional side. Off course it doesn't make a marriage better or more honest that way, true. However if you've found 'the one' so to speak, and it seems Nitro might have , you'd wish you had not give anyone other but her the full view into your life so to speak, so basically I understand where he's coming from and agree actually.

I don't see any reason to not have sex before marriage per say, however it should happen with someone you really love, even if it turns out to be one-sided love or no love at all, the only way to find out, is to try I guess,

Cheers

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You'd be surprised how much of the Christian population is like this tho. I have left congregations not because I didnt want to go to church, but because some of the ways that the majority of some of the members acted, the problem with typical christians is they dont use any critical thinking skills, such as for the swearing thing... most people are taught by thier parents that swearing is bad... but they never stop and ask why, its only offensive because what?... because we decided as a society that [censored] is worse than the word crap? but because our traditionalist mentality in the christian churchs deems it blasphemy if you disagree with a pastor, most people just march like puppets following this "tradition"

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To be able to share a happy marriage you will have to "know" the person as good as you can.
and since sex is the most intimate situation you can get in with another person (or more ) you will have to take the step first to be able to judge right. anything else would be just guessing, if you are honest.

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Your assuming that sex would help you determine if you loved someone, yet sex does in no way determine if someone is "loveable". Sex is an act that occurs with someone that you have already loved. If you can only determine that you loved someone based upon how happy you are when your having sex with them, then you are a shallow person indeed.

You talk about sex eliminating the guesswork. Yet sex is sex, if I see a girl that is very hot looking, I really dont need to have sex with her to know if the sex will be good, sex is definitely good with whatever girl your attracted to. Sex is universal not individual, sex will physically feel good with whatever girl you do it with.

And I also can tell you from experience that sex with someone you truly love is much more satisfying than with women that you dont love, and in some cases with women that you dont even particularly like.

So the whole idea of needing to know a girl sexually before you can determine if you love them is a lie, and it is the same lie which has been used by men to get women into bed for decades.

Sex is going to be good with whatever girl you are attracted to, whether she can hang off the ceiling fan during intercourse or whatever skill she has is no basis for a relationship, and is certainly no basis for love.

According to that mentality a guy would have to sexually sample as much of the female population as possible because "there can always be someone better"

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Very true, but it's about feelings, the emotional side. Off course it doesn't make a marriage better or more honest that way, true. However if you've found 'the one' so to speak, and it seems Nitro might have , you'd wish you had not give anyone other but her the full view into your life so to speak, so basically I understand where he's coming from and agree actually.

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Ya, and you would be surprised how many people ask me how we managed to have such a happy marriage when their lives are so complicated and messed up. I have talked to many girls in their late 20's who now are wishing they had children or someone like me who would love them and committ, but now they are finding that guys simply dont want them as much because they are getting older and they have so much "experience". No guy wants to committ to them because they are all too busy having these tenuous relationships. Trust me, your early 20's dont last long at all.

edit:after all, noone wants to be stuck alone listening to old air supply songs, noone
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lE6Htee0sA

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and I dont try, Im not talking about just going up to people and preaching at them. It never happens that way.

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Why not?

Just make a game that does it for you?

NOAH 2 SOUNDCLIPS

TURN! TURN FROM YOUR EVIL WAYS!

and

THE LAKE OF FIRE!


But, if you present it like I did, then they might laugh their little tails off, but oh well.


Hey, but nice thread going here guys. Too bad I have no time to participate. I'm trying to program MULTIPLAYER right now and do a level and graphics and are just dieing. Sheesh. <too much work>

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and I dont try, Im not talking about just going up to people and preaching at them. It never happens that way.


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Why not?

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