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Re: A Space Project [Re: frazzle] #134140
06/06/07 22:46
06/06/07 22:46
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 9,859
F
FBL Offline
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FBL  Offline
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F

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Posts: 9,859
MK1 did a good job.

Re: A Space Project [Re: FBL] #134141
06/06/07 23:23
06/06/07 23:23
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,177
Netherlands
PHeMoX Offline
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Yeah, too bad you can see the nebula borders a bit too sharp, that could need a little fade, but it sure looks good to me,

Cheers


PHeMoX, Innervision Software (c) 1995-2008

For more info visit: Innervision Software
Re: A Space Project [Re: FBL] #134142
06/06/07 23:54
06/06/07 23:54
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 7,439
Red Dwarf
Michael_Schwarz Offline OP
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Michael_Schwarz  Offline OP
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Quote:

MK1 did a good job.



yeah
no seriousley, we both are working on this its a 50/50 ratio

Quote:

Yeah, too bad you can see the nebula borders a bit too sharp, that could need a little fade, but it sure looks good to me,





thats a flaw in the bloom shader, sadly


"Sometimes JCL reminds me of Notch, but more competent" ~ Kiyaku
Re: A Space Project [Re: Michael_Schwarz] #134143
06/08/07 15:44
06/08/07 15:44
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,177
Netherlands
PHeMoX Offline
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Quote:

thats a flaw in the bloom shader, sadly




Could be I guess, but I think it also must mean there's no gradient of color over there then.

Edit: does your bloom shader work with treshold values, isn't it tweakable?

Cheers


PHeMoX, Innervision Software (c) 1995-2008

For more info visit: Innervision Software
Re: A Space Project [Re: PHeMoX] #134144
06/08/07 16:29
06/08/07 16:29
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Posts: 7,439
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Michael_Schwarz Offline OP
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I don't know, i'm a shader noob and using Sylex


"Sometimes JCL reminds me of Notch, but more competent" ~ Kiyaku
Re: A Space Project [Re: Michael_Schwarz] #134145
06/08/07 18:06
06/08/07 18:06
Joined: Dec 2000
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mk_1 Offline

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All you have to do is to change the bright pass. The nebula actually has a sharp border it just isn't visible if bloom isn't activated. If I've got some time I'll create a new sky box.


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Re: A Space Project [Re: Michael_Schwarz] #134146
06/08/07 21:17
06/08/07 21:17
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 3,208
Germany
Error014 Offline
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Error014  Offline
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I don't think its as astonishing as most people here think, but it certainly looks good! Due to the fact that you requested to be "nailed down" and that you already got lots of positive feedback, I'll just give you critics . I'm aware that some of the following stuff is subjective, so ignore if if you must.

I understand that shaders are all the rage now, so of course you had to use bloom here. Personally, I'm not such a big fan of it, but these are things that you have to see in motion. Right now, I'm just worried that its so "bloomy" that I'll get dizzy when I play it. Don't laugh, I'm a sensible guy, pal!

Even though I'm the minority here, I think that the background is too bright. The bloomshader certainly doesn't help!
I am aware that sometimes, there are pretty bright spots you can - wait for it - spot on nebulas, but are you sure you didn't overdo it? I just went into paint, pasted your last screenshot in there and used the "fill"-tool on the middle of the nebula. This is what I got:



So everything thats pink now was (almost) completely white - a bit much, don't ya think? Maybe tone it down a little. If I were you, I'd try to decrease the contrast by just a little on that "reddish" nebula. Also, is the whole background that colorful or do you only have a few selected spots (=nebulas)? The last spacesim I played was Freelancer, so I'm sorry I'm not up to date, but I liked what I saw there: well distributed colors, with a few selected spots that had "highlights" in them. Well, whatever.

The biggest flaw - the clearly visible border - was brought up enough times already, so I won't bother mentioning it again!

What I really, REALLY don't like is the ship. What kind of ship is that? I wouldn't want to fly in that ship. I wouldn't feel safe at all. Call me crazy, but why are there only a few metallic "bars"? I assume that the rest must be glass or something, but that much? It kind of destroys the sci-fi, overly-technical mood you've got there.
And then... it's so boring! I'm sorry, but... there is nothing exciting for me to see! It's just... grey. There is no structure, only a shadow and OMGSHADER. Please, do me a favor and make it more exciting. I want to see flying text all over the place and wireframes and beeps and everything else everyone thought was futuristic back in the eighties (Not really - but please add some more details and make it look a bit more "cool")
Although I'm not a modeller, I'm also not so sure on the distribution of polygons. As far as details go, well, there are two... things, which I assume to be screens (in bright blue, no less) and two handles and thats all that looks detailful to me. Whats with the two grey bars right in the middle up to the very top? I'm aware that this makes it look extremely technical, but I'm sure I would get tired of them pretty quickly, especially because they just look dull and block so much of my view! I don't care if its realistic or not, I want to see what I shoot up (because, I'm sure, thats what I'll do in your game. Right?). Grey and then theres nothing to it.

I like the particles that seem to fly towards you. Makes you think like you really move.

The asteroids look good, although a bit of variation wouldn't hurt. But whats with the ... other things that fly around? The... uh... what it is? A barrel? The round thing. The one that might look like a "U" from the side. Or maybe more a "c". I don't know what it is. Sorry. No clue. I know what you'll say, though! It's space junk! And thus, it can look like a metallic U! Okay, then. I hope you'll add more variation the the spacejunk!

And what is that other thing? A spacestation? It's parts are too small for that - where would everyone go? It also is dangerously close to asteroids. If I were on board on a spacestation with A MILLION ASTEROIDS right next to me (without the spacestation shooting them, no less), I'd leave pretty quickly!
... Maybe it was a prototype for a lightsaber...
So my final guess is that its some kind of checkpoint. To make sure you won't get lost in the asteroidfield. In the final game, you might consider adding a stylish HUD that could explain these things to me, so that I never have to guess again where exactly that metallic "U" might be from, almost as big as spaceships, no less, which all don't seem to have any round part at all, aside from their screens.

I can't say much about the coding, but it seems that one is ROTATING ALL THE TIME. I can see the spacestation in at least four completely different orientations. Thats cool for us "LOLELITE" players, but don't forget the people that want to try something new for a change and try your game out. These people have a hard enough time to control anything in a 3d-environment, they won't have too much fun when they lose orientation all the time. I guess I also would lose orientation sooner or later. In Freelancer, they'd put you in your "normal orientation" after a while. Consider adding something like this!

Too bad theres no story yet. I'd have loved to take a look . And now you have to create a story with metallic space junk that looks like "U"s! ... Or maybe not

So... all in all, thats quite a good start! But it still seems to miss many important things: Gameplay, for example. Or is that game all about flying in an asteroid-field? Show me an intense spacebattle! Make a story! Right now, it screams prototype (even though theres no gameplay, so its only a prototype for part of your game), but theres nothing wrong with that.
Don't hate me for this - I sometimes exaggerated a little. It's all in the name of fun (mine, at least ). Plus, you two are "professional" (a term that I'm slowly starting to hate) enough for it. So then, I hope it helps and I look forward to see more of this soon. Even though sometimes my post might paint a different picture

Last edited by Error014; 06/08/07 21:19.

Perhaps this post will get me points for originality at least.

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Re: A Space Project [Re: Error014] #134147
06/08/07 21:54
06/08/07 21:54
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 7,439
Red Dwarf
Michael_Schwarz Offline OP
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Hi Error!
I hoped you were coming up to criticise my project, as your answers are the most honest, and so far the most productive - Thank you!

As for the screen you have filled. I already know someone would call to that, but that noone did and that it is you i wouldt have thought of. It it would be someone elses project I would already have called attention to that. But you dont have to worry there. It's just while you use the "Boost", some kind of speed flash that lets appear everything much brigther than it is(annotation: if you use the boost, the faster you get, the more difficult it will get to steer- so in emergency situatioons you have to decide between speed or maneuvrability(or however that is written)). Anyhow, MK.1 wrote a beautiful shader to create a "tunnel-effect" i had planned, I still have to figure out how to get Sylex to use it, as it always crashes

MOst of the things you can see are just for the sake of it. Speedmodelling so we actually had ANYTHING we could test the scripts on(cockpit shaking for instance). The "metallic-U-thingys" is a short try on space junk from broken space ships, and i am aware that there are missing many details

And also dont worry about the numbers in the edge: DEBUG! - And we have no GUI yet, so it's the simple way to see if all the variables get the right values (especially the "bounce-back" effect when you fly against an asteroid for example, hard time getting that thing work).

I will try to upload an video tonight, so you will se most things in action and get to see why things appear strange on the screenshots.

---

##SPOILER SPOILER##

I am planning that you will be able to move around your ship. So you can just stand up from your cockpit seat and run around your ship. On a small ship, this is of course just the cockpit and the cargo bay, but hey - on a big star cruiser you can explore the big ship --- just make sure you put someone on duty or turn the autopilot on - or you will end up crashing into a asteroid field and your 9 billion dollar starship ends up in thousand metallic-u-thingy pieces

---

Oh.. the station is a Singularity-Power-Plant, theres noone aboard so there is no need for space on there

Thanks again for your helpful critics!

Greetings
Mike


"Sometimes JCL reminds me of Notch, but more competent" ~ Kiyaku
Re: A Space Project [Re: Michael_Schwarz] #134148
06/09/07 00:23
06/09/07 00:23
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 7,439
Red Dwarf
Michael_Schwarz Offline OP
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Michael_Schwarz  Offline OP
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## DOUBLE POST POWER! ##

Here you go with the videos.

Long but low quality video - Download (.wmv)(13MB)
Some information: Somehow there is a bug when switching from a higher res to a lower one, the "center" is the lower right edge, when It should be the center, so it looks weird when the ship is moving.
Also, there seem to be some problems with z-clipping while recording the video, don't know why it happens- It doesn't when I am not recording.

Short but HiRes video (1024x768) - Download (.wmv)(2MB)

Well, just to show you how movement should look when the center is not "misplaced" as in the low resolution.

---

C&C welcome as always


"Sometimes JCL reminds me of Notch, but more competent" ~ Kiyaku
Re: A Space Project [Re: Michael_Schwarz] #134149
06/09/07 03:47
06/09/07 03:47
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,538
WA, Australia
J
JibbSmart Offline
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,538
WA, Australia
i just saw the short video, and i like it! the space seems quite empty, and i would like to see a smoother cockpit (if its so close to the camera all the time, there's no shame in investing some more polys in it).

i would like to see a little more variety in the asteroids -- particularly in size. it would be awesome to fly around (or through) enormous asteroids, and it would help fill-out the scenery. more colour variety would look nice as well

julz


Formerly known as JulzMighty.
I made KarBOOM!
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