by that logic, SED is a cutscene editor and your tool is superfluous i have no doubt it's useful, but any programmer writes functions they can use again. it doesn't become an editor because i use functions over and over again. it's just a part of the workflow.

i'm sure many would appreciate your cutscene editor, and good on you for being generous about it. phemox specifically said a what he does is modular, so it can be used over and over. it's just a different way of approaching it. i was simply pointing out that the difficulty of our approach is being exaggerated.

julz

Julz, as a programmer I understand your position. What I dont get is the following:

Modular function do not help the community if they are not available. So if we agree to implement your idea then it would be best to have a cutscene-template available in the T7 pack.

But if everybody writes an editor like (yung) or a script library like you or Phemox, then it is no workflow at all. It needs much more programming for everybody of us.

Because of that every modern language supports components, re-usable classes or com objects. So it is easy to exchange solutions.

And besides that all modelling and animation packages use a visual interface to create such data and I think for good reasons

I am sure that the approach of yung is a very good one.

Mmmmm, that's probably the point, I think this is a pointless discussion because it seems to be all about the programmer vs. artist perspective here.

I totally second Julz on the things he said about difficulty and trust me, I'm not a very good programmer! The whole point of our approach is that we re-use code that we must have in our projects anyways. It's as customizable as making a game itself. More complicated cutscenes will need extra code anyways.. cut-scene editors or not,

Cheers

ahh the A7 thing again , yes it's a complete dissapointment to non programmers , and programmers , well , why on earth would you use gamestudio to begin with ? There's better engines for the programming heads to use, as you should at least know another language like C++ or delphi or something to call yourselv a programmer , if it's C-Script you program and moving to lite-c then here's news for you , YOUR NOT A PROGRAMMER , go learn a real language and do some real coding. As for the workflow thing , yeah , gamestudio failed to improve any of that with A7 , I dont even know how that could be called A7 , it;s A6.90 or something , everything thats been on the forcast is still there , lol , wasnt the forcast suff suppossed to be stuff for the next engine ? But no need to keep saying it , I think everyone already knows it , maybe A8 will be what A7 was suppossed to be , who knows , who cares , I'm sticking with A6 for all my current projects , and when I need to work on soem type of next gen game , I'll just look for a good alternative.

btw , to the one who said Next Gen is a marketing term and doesnt mean anything , lol , it means a game with the new shader technology , the difference between ut2004 and unreal tournament 3 .

ah, why_do_i_die's contribution again.

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yes it's a complete dissapointment to non programmers , and programmers , well , why on earth would you use gamestudio to begin with ?

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if you're not a programmer, what are you doing here? why are you even using a game-engine? make renders with blender. it's free, and you have much less to worry about in terms of aesthetics-vs-speed. why can't you get a job as a game artist? if you have one, why are you even here?

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if it's C-Script you program and moving to lite-c then here's news for you , YOUR NOT A PROGRAMMER , go learn a real language and do some real coding.

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learning C-script or lite-C is a great way for aspiring programmers to learn how to program. also, lite-C has almost all the functionality of C, and soon it will surpass that with the forecast support for classes. C programmers can do just about whatever they want with it, and C++ programmers can do just about whatever they want via the SDK.

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As for the workflow thing , yeah , gamestudio failed to improve any of that with A7 , I dont even know how that could be called A7 , it;s A6.90 or something , everything thats been on the forcast is still there , lol , wasnt the forcast suff suppossed to be stuff for the next engine ? But no need to keep saying it , I think everyone already knows it , maybe A8 will be what A7 was suppossed to be , who knows , who cares , I'm sticking with A6 for all my current projects , and when I need to work on soem type of next gen game , I'll just look for a good alternative.

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i agree that there's been no workflow improvements. i personally don't have a problem with it -- blender for art and program everything else -- but i can understand if some aren't too chuffed about it. however, as of the next update, A7 has a huge improvement in the post-processing effects workflow, and this is a really big deal for shader programmers AND non programmers trying to implement post-processing effects from other people. T7 and the interactive level editor are in public beta and should be in an official update soon. as to other forecast features still being there -- almost all the stuff that's still there is almost finished or in beta. we have a lot coming out soon, and those who already own A7 will have those features as soon as they are available.

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btw , to the one who said Next Gen is a marketing term and doesnt mean anything , lol , it means a game with the new shader technology , the difference between ut2004 and unreal tournament 3 .

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there's obviously a generation gap between the unreal engines. what's being discussed is the term "next gen" being used to describe the quality of graphics in games. there's nothing "next gen" about it unless it hasn't been done before. it has a fairly clear meaning -- great graphics -- but the choice of words is just marketing hype.

basically i can understand you not being happy with A7 yet, and sticking with A6, but you tend to portray your own opinion as the best, but at the moment seems to lack a certain degree of education in regards to the matters discussed

julz

LOL, everyone knows Wii is not next gen , you'd have to be retarded to believe that.

Ah the programmers vs artist debates , well programmer wana bes because if ur a scripter your not a programmer, lol. From the front page "Gamestudio is not a game engine, not a game editor, and not a game programming language. It's all of them together" Can you read that ? Do you understand what it means ? Can that clue you as to why some are dissapointed ? Yes, Lite-C is suppossed to be more advanced than C-Script , but the point is we already had C-Scipt , we had just moved to C-Script in A5 , why would the focus of A7 be a new scripting language , it's retarded , thats why I was dissapointed.

How can I put this so that you will understand , The reason people come to gamestudio is because it offers the ability to get into game development withought having to be a full programmer , so , if your an artist , and like games , you get gamestudio to make game making much easier. Programmers tend to not even like gamestudio , because it's stupid to want to use gamestudio as ur engine if your a programmer , there's better options out there for those. Lite-C is useless garbage , because we already had the SDK for DLL making. But to be honest , I prolly just made assumptions about A7 i shouldnt have , but I dont see how I could think A7 was going to be A6 with a new scripting language , oh and a new render that renders exactly like the old one, incredible. Only an idiot would support conitec's decision , even if your a programmer , you still shouldfind it shitty that you still have to programm every single thing you need, as you still have more work to do even for simple things.

I myself know how to C-Script , so I'm not a pure artist , In fact , I actualy enjoy scripting , so I dont just make art and see chinese when I see a script , but , even though I like scripting , since I do levels, models , and script , I would have much prefered to have the other additions I've poited in the past to a new scripting language , render that renders the same as old one , and a couple of other things here and there that i'll never notice.

Another thing I felt dissapointed with , is the lack of tech demo , and lack of art that came wth A7. When is Conitec going to hire someone to make a good model pack to include with it's software ? We have a couple of very good artists here in the community , and many others aroun the web who do freelance for pretty decentprices , why is it that gamestudio still comes with Quake 1 qualty mdels (in fact , they are worst , quake at least had cool models) , and textures. Now this is something everyone , including the programmers would benefit from , having a solid
model pack , texure pack , soudn pack , music pack . Now this might sound abmitious , but it isnt , for a company like conitec it should be very cheap to hire some freelance artists to make some good stuff for fairly cheap pricess, I mean , even I've hired people before to make me a model here and there , how is it that conitec cant afford to do that ?

So there's a thousand and one reasons for my dislike/dissapointment with A7 , how there's people who justify it is beyond my comprehension , but you have to COMPARE it to A5 and A6 , and not judge it like it's a brad new engine , what you really have to judge is it's prgrogress from one engine version to the next , not just the engine itself.

Please let us make steps forwards and not backwards... we are talking about the workflow of the engine and not about complaints of edgy people which tend to freak out a little bit too often - seriously.

I wonder if Conitec would be willing to buy/pay for 3rd party tools / plugins to fully integrate it into the 3D Gamestudio suite.