No my friend we are not all equal , this is pure demagogy
A scientist is not the same as a poet
Let the former not to talk about Oratius's metrics and the latter about nuclear power plants

I'll be amazed if you bring anything new to the table. Hasn't this topic been beat (down) to death on these forums?

Why am I not surprised to hear this from you... It's really pure ignorance on your side to think that scientists and people that have actually studied the problems, wouldn't ever know what to do. Their educated guess is a lot more valuable than some manic preacher saying we are all going to die if we don't do whatever he says. God no, not a voting system... please, people are far too easily convinced by religious leaders, maniacs, conspiracies, such a system would be devastating. Sure it sounds nice in theory, but it simply won't work.



This is where you are wrong. We might be equal as human, yes, but there's a good reason why self-proclaimed experts in our societies AREN'T the ones in charge.

In fact, there still aren't enough politicians that really do what was suggested by 'professionals'. No, scientists are like 'advisers' for them... so basically your 'voting system' is in place. Just vote for the politician that comes closest to your beliefs.

I am aware that there probably will be professionals that disagree with eachother and that mistakes can be made because of this, but mistakes are being made anyways.

let me put it this way:

The probability of the LHC creating a black hole that will eat up the entire world is as high as creating a speaking green pig saying "ROFL".

Possible? Yes.
Probable? No.

"We are nót equal on making decisions.
Only people who have studied for it (statistics, human psychology, physics, chemics, etc in this case) are qualified to draw the right conclusions build upon solid facts."

Yes my friend , you should really get a good unbiased history book and read it to see the desicions this so called "qualified decision takers" have taken throughout our time before commenting nonsence. You say withought this people there would be havok ? No man , there would be just people living on earth , which is what we are meant to do. Again , open up ur mind , just a little , and you will see what I mean.

"No my friend we are not all equal , this is pure demagogy
A scientist is not the same as a poet
Let the former not to talk about Oratius's metrics and the latter about nuclear power plants"

And thats a big flaw of this system , who says you need to be a scientist to know about a nuclear plant ? I fully understand how a nuclear reactor works and how nuclear bombs work and how they are manufactured , I am not a scientist , but I understand what this things are , and clearly see their dangers , I dont think you need to be a scientist to figure out if nuclear bombs are safe for us. The problem is most people (like yourself) assume the people in charge will always make the proper decisions for us , when in fact , they mostly do the complete opposite.

If you believe you have no say in what happens in the world , thats fine , thats your stance , I believe we all should have a say , this world is just as much mine as it is the president's or the royal families of the world. I refuse to believe I should submit , you on the other hand seem to accept the place they have given you in life.

"The probability of the LHC creating a black hole that will eat up the entire world is as high as creating a speaking green pig saying "ROFL"."

Well , thats the EXACT same possibility of finding the higgs , yet they believe it's enough possibility to create a 6 billion dollar machine to look for it , how does this not sink into your head ?
Possibility of finding higs and of creating a black hole are THE SAME , EXACTLY THE SAME, you must first understand that , then realize how much money and effort they are putting into the project to understand the real chance of this happening in theory.
However , I do believe the higs is bullshit , so , I guess there isnt too much to worry about.

I now understand this is just another experiment to fuel more money into the physisists , who unlike regular people who work for their bread and butter need the government to feed them with taxpayers money.


"Their educated guess is a lot more valuable than some manic preacher saying we are all going to die if we don't do whatever he says"

I dont wanna get too into this , but if you actually research , and I do mean ACTUALLY RESEARCH all the theories , you will come to the conclusion that the religions are much closer to the truth than the scientists. I will post a topic on this tomorrow or the day after when I have time , but I can assure you , darwinism and evolution are become more and more obsolete as the days go by, oh , and by the findings of scientists themselves to add to the irony.

There could very well be havoc, and this chance is definately much bigger than the LHC generating earth-swallowing black holes.
We are living on this planet right now, and we do not need total world havoc for that to happen. So I don't understand why you would draw that conclusion.

Without even taking the prove I provided from this very forum in concideration, hence just totaly ignore it and aim directly at my 'counter-opinion', this discussion becomes worthless and I hope in real life you keep your strange thoughts only for yourself.

Well, but now we are talking about spending 6 billion dollars, not anymore about creating earth-swallowing black-holes, and THAT is the point actually.

And infact, the probability of finding the Higgs is tremendously higher. But even if we would assume its the same, and lets assume we DONT find the higgs. Then we would find something else.

And to be upright honestly about it. Six billion dollars for finding the answer to life... I think that is still pretty cheap. The answer TO LIFE. The question that bugged humankind since we were crawling in caves. I think it's far more worth than 6 billion dollars.

You don't even (want to) understand how evolution works, let alone how most sciences work. I doubt your opinion would even be remotely useful. Do I approve of scientists working with nuclear reactors? Yes, despite all the risks I do. Whether you like it or not, solving the energy problem in the long run probably has more to do with atomic bombs that you'd understand.



So why don't you blame the people in charge? They are the ones making the wrong decisions, like invading Iraq.... Scientists just give their educated opinions and often this is based on solid evidence. Does this mean scientists can't ever be wrong? Hell no, they don't claim to be omniscient, they aren't Gods.

Besides, I do not assume people in charge will always make the right decisions. In fact, often they won't because a lot of them are selfish, ignorant and we do not exactly vote the most brightest to power... On the other hand, would a person like Einstein be able to run a country? For various reasons, probably not.

To vastly improve the change of making the right decisions, you need to have the combined knowledge of the scientific community, merged into one opinion. You will see that there will often be two sides and there will always be the risk of being wrong.



Depending on your definition of pig, this is clearly impossible. :p



You are being vague and seem to claim that once again science is all wrong and evil. I really doubt you can prove what you claim here. You put too much trust in pseudo-scientists the way I see it.



If wars are worth spending hundreds of billions on... this definitely is far more worth by any definition.

The Crackpot Index
by John Baez



A little background: people like Why_do have been contaminating the internet waves since the days of news net. I say contaminate because they are disrepectful and insulting to those that don't agree with them and merely throw ideas out without thought, research, or followup. Hence in the late 80's I think, Baez, the admin for the physics usenet, came up with this index. It is a convenient way to gauge a persons theory... so here we go!



A -5 point starting credit.


-2 for LHC and Evolution


-4 because there are so many, I'm just going to restrict myself to 2


0 I think there have been but as this has been science and not logic, not going to dig for this one.


-10 LHC and science in general


0 Why_do is not big on thought.... experiments.


LOL I get nailed on this one EVERY TIME.


-5 I think Einstein was brought up?


0


0


0


0


0


0


0


-10 This is Why_do's main arguement if I remember


-10 LOL It's like re-reading this thread.


0


0


0 However, you know that why_do's stance will be of the "suppress" kind so I may have to regrade.


0


0 I don't think why_do ever said it was flawed but merely relied on the above ("it's only a theory") for his arguements


0


0


0


0


0


10 partial credit here for why_do never said exaclty the above, but certainly has alluded to it.


0


0


0


0


40 LOL again, it's eerie how accurate this is.


20 partial credit for while why_do does not claim this to be "his" works, he is a conspiracty nu.... errrmmm... person.


0 It's very close to the point above, so I dont' want to double grade.


20 AGain another partial credit for the allusionns why_do makes to this effect.


20 And finally, partial credit for again, why_do doesn't claim it's "his" but he doesn't offer any TESTABLE predictions for his statements.


At 156 if my math is correct (and please correct me if I'm wrong), this s not the worst score I've seen. Why_do's saving grace (and shame) is that none of what he says is his: he is merely a "monkey say; monkey do" and repeating what others are saying without doing the work him/her self. But still I think the index does a good job at showing how UNORIGINAL why_do's brand of ignorance is.

Now it all makes sense!!!


I scoured the internet and finally found a shot of Why_Do at work:




A little more digging and I found one of Why_Do working out the chances of the LHC creating a black hole





Finally, here is a little "preview" of Why_Do's upcoming "evolution vs. creationism" post: