yes, this Zorro thing seems to have not really the best effect on 3dgs development...

Indeed !
And Conitec should really choose their camp like fully concentrated on game making or trading tools.
It reminds me in some way the Gamecore Engine adventure :
MONEY ATTRACTION.

I think 3DGS don't bring enought money, and some 3D engines concurrents just by the amount of published games just show you can't race against them.

Conitec talked about mobile platform lot of months ago, but nothing, they don't have taken the step, and it will take one or two years (or more) before they have something comparable to existing solutions.

So their strategic solution for money is a trading tool ...
game making is just something aside it seems no more the main selling product.

Well ... let's see what will happen in next months ... ?

I agree that is too far away from a gamemaking software. However, what if it does get them the money they needed in which in turn they can use to keep updating Gamestudio 3D? I have the feeling it wont though, it looks too amateur-like (sorry, not meant to be insulting to the developers, just my opnion). But than again, I dont have a crystal ball. So who knows what will happen.

I dont understand the zorro thing and dont have the wish to exploring it.

We are here for gamedeveloping and not pushing money from here to there exept in our cases

I'm happy with the engine so far. Small things like a blender to mdl converter or a nice solution for multitexture terrain on models with mirrorwater would be great.

maybe we just need to publish some cool, goodlooking games to get the motivation back for others
i'm really looking forward to the release of superku and others
first i will have fun playing those and second you can share them (no piracy, just show them the games) with others (maybe friends) and get them to gamestudio

I know this is just some crazy dream, but i won't give up good ol Gamestudio

maybe we just need to publish some cool, goodlooking games to get the motivation back for others
i'm really looking forward to the release of superku and others

The problem, you only find some very few games of real commercial quality each year made with 3D game Studio like SuperCAn for example.

Just browse the amount of Unity 3D games to see the real difference, or some Torque 3D MMO ( Gideon MMO )
Well ...

Mobile would be a BIG BIG accelerator for 3DGS , in terms of games published, advert for 3DGS , so lot more money income
for Conitec.
Nothing on that side, and tablets, Mobile are exploding in terms of selling in the market !
I think they miss a BIG BIG STEP


Even other companies like :
Garage Games (iTorque 2D)
BLitz3D (Monkey for mobile)
Unity 3D
Esenthel Engine
LeadWerks 3D
Dark Basic Pro
Irrlicht
even Blender (Maratis3D engine)
and some others ....
...
have 2D or 3D Mobile solutions !

Indeed 3DGS with only Windows platform, seems to be loosing a big distance from the others companies; because :
- No Mobile solution
- No Flash and 3D support
- No Internet Bowser plugin (without using some other company plugin)
- No Mac support
- No Linux Support(Specially with Indie games)

But that's really the mobile point that really put 3DGS behind, specially when lot of people could concentrate on small games and make real selling also !

Like i said, let's see in the next months if something (or nothing) happens ... ?

Rachet, there are a several commercial games or applications (!), made with Gamestudio. But not every game is published to the public or is presented here. I am not 100% sure if mobile gaming would be a huge win for Gamestudio in general, but given the price policy, it could be a huge saving compared to the Unity 3D pricing. I dont know how much the Android plugin will cost, but A8 pro + Android plugin will be cheaper than Unity 3D Pro with Android plugin

Btw, Irrlicht is no company, but an open source game engine.

The problem is, that you can talk the trash talk everyday, but if you don't do anything, you are no good.

You can't blame the engine for missing shiny pixels if you are the guys that is not providing them.

The problem is, that you can talk the trash talk everyday, but if you don't do anything, you are no good.

I agree a lot with that.

And you can find alos lot lot of people sometimes interested in some 3D features, but never doing any game even some using 3DGS asking some feature without having a real project behind.

-----------

The thing is that i target Mobile game, so i use another engine, i have no choice at all. If 3DGS would have mobile it would be great to use Lite C indeed

I talk about mobile, so i don't seek shiny pixel also, my style will be more simple graphics in BorderLdands game style, or some Cube World Retro style !
For the shiny side, there are already really cheap 3D engines providing complete lithening and shaders solution without having to code and with simple workflow compared to 3DGS.

I talk low price engines, i dont' talk about Proven AAA engines like Unreal that can be a good deal for some people also; and having Mobile support.

--------------

3DGS workflow is a pain when you come back after using some other real time editors ... that the one big weakness.

That's the two points i pointed out, let's see how things will become in the future ... ?
But from 2012 : NOTHING really new, only lot of 3D commands, no new tools, or better workflow for 3D artists ... we are going quickly to 2013, only some months ... an empty year for non programmers people.
Even A7 to A8 have been only new 3D Commands, some new 3D features, but nothing for 3D artists, you keep WED and MED ...

Unity have a great strenght with it's open editor for plugins , that the other weakness of 3DGS that is not oriented for plugins made by users.

But i stop caus i know it's an engine mainly for Programmers ,
so i don't have to complain here.

------------

I use Shiva 3D that is even cheaper (some 180 Euros) than Unity Mobile basic (400 Euros) and have all 3D features.
Mobile requires lot of optimisation also, i'm not sure 3DGS for mobile will as fast as other solution that exist from years now and have evolved ?
Why choosing it when some others solutions are vene lot more advanced (navigation tools, rela time editing etc ..) like with Esenthel for example ? or Shiva 3D ?

Well again, i don't say 3DGS will fall, but that trading tool even on the banner really show Conitec is on the wrong direction and mixes game making and money on the same Forum:(
(specially money trading that is only something bad from my point of view when you see all the problems today, specially with Euro)
Money is needed indeed, but well Conitec should really keep things separated, if not : they make advert and search for
young people or hope some people will buy their tool here
I find that a shame really, but well they have the right, it's their forums.

Really Conitec should really keep appart they money appetite and game making !
For my point of view, it only shows some bad image, like we need money, game making is for another time.

------------

The lack of unified shader / ligthening / Shadow solution ready to use without programming, and lacking from years until today in 3DGS just shows another Weak point.
And shaders have been brought from lot of years (A6 version when i baught it), 3DGS have just been some programmer evolution until now ... nothing really on the editors

The Vegetation editor promised on Forecast from YEARS, well ... where it is ... ??
It's coming ? perhaps ? But i'm happy i don't have waited for it, of i would have wasted years waiting for nothing !

I doubt it will evolve to 3D artist or plugin orientation, and it should continue on the programmer orientation i think.

I don't say it will sink ...
but let's see what will it becomes on the future ?


-----------

Ok it was the thread : The Future Is there One ?

I have given only my taste and point of view
More 3D artist than programmer point of view indeed.


I use other solutions and i find it's a pain coming back to 3DGS and the very very very old tools/editors compared to advanced concurrent solutions.

Take it bad or not, i given my advice on 3DGS.
I like it's programming side, it's magazine, but it's not more enought to keep me using it now as others solutions are improving in the Worflow and 3D artist or Mobility side.
(I doubt 3D artists using some other engine will be able or want to use 3DGS, specially some using visual scripting plugins also.)


Lot of Betas , but for programmers only.
I baught A6, A7,A8 but i really think it will be impossible for me to be interested in A9.
It won't compete fro example with workflow and features/tools
of Unity 3D, Leadwerks 3, Esenthel etc .. etc ...
3DGS is not for 3D artists, i think it resumes very well the situation.

If you would produce more 3D art than programming like me, and if you would need simple click to apply shaders/lightening/shadows/vegetation/grass etc ... and had the priority to go fast, code only gameplay, you would think like me !

So should i sound bad, or talking trash, don't take it bad ; it's my taste only.
Conitec have their orientation, decisions, customer type target, it's their strategy !
I respect that , only that strategy don't suit 3D artists like me and lot of others.


Anyway good night to all programmers and long life to 3DGS also to make happy all of them


[b][/b]

Well speaking of the workdlow, the only 2 things that really annoy me of Gamestudio 3D and those have to do with the editors:

1. You can't color your texts in SED (except for 'comment line') to tidy your script.

2. Mapping in WED is annoying (the camera feels to restricted, shooting out with mouse cursor and moving something else than planned etc.).

But I recently noticed that they are community editors to somewhat replace SED and WED, so these problems are probably solved than too (I hope ).
Also is GED worth looking into?

yes, it really started to disturb me, as I'm not experienced at all in this field, but in other engines (in the same price category) I can get really fine solutions (e.g. in Neoaxis it is really nice and fast and just one click to set, in Esenthel only a few lines of code). so another thing to learn

anyway 3DGS is still very good for starting 3D game making, and for one person project development (especially if it is only a hobby, like in my case), mainly thanks to Lite-C what I really like. when I selected 3DGS I knew that I had to make my own game specific level editor, so I do not really care WED/GED, MED is usually okay as a mainly conversion step.

achieving commercial graphics quality by 3DGS probably requires more knowledge and work-time than in other engines, but in other engines programming requires more efforts... (or more money like in case of Unity what I do not plan to pay, and the free version is too restricted)

so imo 3DGS would be much better, if not only starting would be supported well by tutorials and AUM examples, but if a few small but commercial quality open source example projects would be released by the developer (could be third party), from where you could take ready to use solutions, fine tuned for this engine, and not only the community would give good advices for particular problems. it could be for a little extra money like in case of Esenthel, or free like in Neoaxis, it's a question of marketing.

GED :
Sorry, i used it, not incredible, and LOT LOT of bugs an dcrashes on my PC
Even if some editors are coming , like Vegetation tools on Forecats , lest' hope it won't take years for users ... ?


anyway 3DGS is still very good for starting 3D game making, and for one person project development (especially if it is only a hobby, like in my case), mainly thanks to Lite-C what I really like. when I selected 3DGS I knew that I had to make my own game specific level editor, so I do not really care WED/GED, MED is usually okay as a mainly conversion step.
You are in a special case of a programmer and that use it as Hobby, not specially targetting a game could it be free or not. So indeed it suits you.

And im' not sure Unity 3D for example would be complicated , it's easy to sue , specially with C# once you get the basics.
(Simple commands to call).
And just look at great quality plugins that exists with Unity 3D , it just prooves you could make your own editing tools as easy as the people that made the plugins
Even LeadWerks 3 will have some plugin orientation also to allow people to easy make custom editors or tools.

What lacks really is that :
- No unified lightening solution with shaders/Shadows/lights
- No plugin open oriented editor
- No mobile support
- No solid and fast real time editing
- No lot better workflow
- No today editor with panels and drag and drop features
- No GUI editor
- No advanced particle editor
- No easy lightmap import or generator
- No grass/Tress/vegetation tool
- No complete terrain editro (even if it will come from some users)
- No physic visual editor (character capsule adding and adjustemnt done in some minute), solid primitives visual adjustment etc ...

And i must forget some points.
But that's ok for programmers, caus they don't care about fast/easy workflow or visual editing tools !

For 3D artist using other engines , that don't care programming (only gameplay programming), it's hard to use , and hard to put a secen with complete lightening, or terrain and vegetation level etc ...

Well it does the job for programmers, and Lite C is great.
Conitec have is own strategy, indeed, i respect their decisions, and like any other engines, it will have it's followers and some that will leav it also.

For my part i won't wait years ... solution in indie market already exist if you have some project game idea.

But who knows ? perhaps they will surprise us with some solid lightening solution, or some mobile features one day ?