u call farting zombies a soul ? i'd NEVER buy a game for that type of "soul", a "soul" is a unique element that separates your game from the crowd, something that gives it personality, cool characters, memorable worlds, nice atmosphere, unique gameplay, i'm not saying his idea sucks but hes DRAMATICALLY reducing is potential clients, as obviously seen already

as i said, i liked the first beta, i would just start it up and kill shit, collect some orbs for my stopping powers and have fun, i played it in different ways, pistols only, shotgun only, without killing an enemy and so on, then the second beta came out and added some stuff and honestly, i was like.. bleh

so am saying, take advantage of what you had that worked, allow the orbs dropped to trigger more abilities, i see what you were going for but i think we all see the challenges, you make a game people want to play, not for your/our personal taste, our tastes is just to add a bit of "soul" to our games but you gotta know what challenges comes with each idea

plus, what would make a single player zombie shooter replayable if not for the quick pickup gameplay, even if you want to have girls and whatever in the game, sure but dont highlight them so it looks like a gimmick



lol thats a trick question right ? duke had its fair share of "wtf is this" moment also PLUS it was one of the first game like that in its time so thats its "soul", its as if someone tried to clone halo, people would bash it soo hard, not saying it WOULD fail but it'd have a fight. Thats also why i am not a fan of remakes because i think theres a world of ideas and untried themes out there..


ahm differentiates ? soo.. why are we immidiately comparing this to duke if its so differentiated and has its own unique "soul" ?

am not saying his theme is BAD, am saying his theme will limit is audience and indies already have a limited audience, just stating that i prefer the fun gameplay of the first beta, i started losing interest when this "soul" started showing up in the game, that may probably also be why steam rejected the game, this "soul" surpasses even some of their most mature content, it makes gears of war look like a teen game

What characteristics do you have in mind when you think about the last published AAA shooters (Modern Warefare titles, Crysis 2, Bioshock 2, Mass Effect 2)? You'll name "great visuals, good story, ...) but what else? Nothing you'll smile about or something you'd show to your friends and say "Hey, this one is sooo funny and different to all that other stuff!". And these are exactly the games I want to play But of course it is a question of taste ...

I can understand your sentiment when Steam rejects your game that I am sure you all worked really hard on Zapan. They also rejected Silas without any reason.

This is my experience with them up until now(for my game Silas):

1. First time 3 years ago I contacted them, got a canned email saying it's not a fit for their service. They said I can contact back later when I am done more. Nothing else.

2. Second time I contact them and they gave the same canned response. Said I can contact later if I want. Nothing else.

3. Third time, I went and actually talked with them at the GDC in 2010. The guy liked my game, talked price points, ect.

Then.... when I got home he wouldn't respond to an email. And about 5 months later randomly responded and said he wanted a trailer for a meeting. After that, no contact until 3 months later, and I get the exact canned response from years earlier!!

So he said I can submit when I am near finished.

4. Last time was this past March, I gave them a copy of the non-complete Silas at GDC 2011. I actually sat in the Valve booth and was playing my game with about 20 of their employees. The Steam rep I talked with the year earlier was walking around and watched for 5 mins. He said he was too busy for me to demo it to him, and also said he didn't have time to talk.

But eventually after waiting 2 hrs he came and talked with me and said that he "didn't remember anything being wrong with my game" and that he will review the full game and get back in one week. We once again talked price points and he watched my trailer and seemed to like the game. I told him Silas will most likely be releasing on all the other services but Steam.

5. A week later I get.... guess what, even after talking with everyone from Valve reason face to face, and their own employees loved it. ---- The same canned response from earlier. Not even one word different in the email.

Direct2Drive, GamersGate, Impulse, Beamdog, ect. all I talked, sat down and demoed, responded to emails. Now I understand these companies are very busy but this was something different.

So I assume the reason they didn't want Silas was because I wasn't "indie famous" yet. Meaning I did not become a contest finalist, I didn't sell many copies, and I don't have a large portion of the internet watching my project.

So basically, you can really have a great game and Steam will still reject you. They did not review my online game as I actually tracked it through my online database. I have a feeling they don't review others. You just need to be known. Or if you are a big publisher you have a direct line.

Steam is a monopoly now. They won't take any risks with us small guys anymore.

But don't let this get you down too much, because it happened to countless of indie developers. And eventually, through the other services or elsewhere they got a few sales and then Steam put them on after release. Many huge indie hits got rejected on Steam before finally being put up(Star Ruler, A.I wars, Braid if I remember right).

Whether Silas will ever get on Steam I don't know. But I will finish it and release it anyways because in the end, no Steam isn't gonna stop me from making a great game. Although it does make me sad because the whole reason of moving to Digital Distribution was to break away from the big guys(EA, ect.) and their retail buddies. And now were stuck with the exact same many years later just in a digital form. Who knows, maybe Steam won't even have a contact email address on their site in the years to come if they get big enough.

We owe it to ourselves to support the other digital services. Get on Impulse, Desura, D2D. Their is absolutely nothing proprietary about Steams services. There is no reason that should be peoples only place to view and buy games.

last i heard d2d was kinda dying, Desura is a very nice option(make sure your game is moddable though), There is now also EA's Origin but IDK they sell anything other than EA games.

@PadMalcom:
There are certain things that cant be changed too much, a shooter is a shooter, alot of people love their standard FPS and the fact that crysis, halo, killzone, call of duty ALL have their individual fan-bases show that there's enough difference between each title, other than visuals.

Alot of games are repeating elements, especially from Cod but most try to differentiate their game anyway, crysis plays really different from Cod for example, i do agree that alot of the AAA games seem to just be repeating elements but some games, especially FPS don't need great changes to the genre for it to be awesome, it just needs some small sweet additions

A games THEME doesnt make people play it, it attracts people but people stay for the gameplay, so if your theme is rejecting but your gameplay is good, you limit your market

@William
Am surprised they rejected silas, guess it shows though that they dont rush at game for looking good, i agree though with that they seem to only want projects with a bit of fame, its sad but, can you blame them ?


[Generalizing]

if your game is any good, it should start getting some attention if you have it on other distributors, if its good, then moving it to steam should be easier, i don't think steam rejecting anyone should mean their game isn't good.

Even if they wanted to assist all indies, i can imagine them reaching a point where they start filtering out the weak guys, they are humans afterall, we just have to prove ourselves, they want something that sells, not just looks good. I'm not supporting their business model just that it doesnt seem too hard to understand.

Wohowowowow... look at the first gameplay trailer of duke nukem on youtube... there is a blowjob for the pleasure of duke... not only hot dancing girls on tables.
Seems that you are completely wrong with your opinion of banning x-rated stuff in fun games.


edit
I told zapan before, that when I was playing his first trash demo, I was completely with no doubt, that he will make a hit budget game. In the first ambient you could include tons of cutted porn movies, hardcore action... without problem. I personally think, that the second demo changed the concept of the first idea.
This could have been a mistake.

how am i wrong ? i clearly addressed this point x_x



so maybe you were the one completely wrong of what my opinion was

[EDIT]
i had some of my friend over as i played the second beta and yes my frenz dont have any problems with porn but when they saw the stupid porn vid in the theatre, their reactions were: "WTF is this crap? someone ACTUALLY made this??"

Not even dukeNukem would do that, duke has a hint of humour to their x-rated stuff, they always make it seem comical and a little funny, THAT is duke, duke doesnt take itself seriously when it comes to x-rated stuff, duke seems more like a parody of x-rated stuff.

playing REAL porn videos in a videogame is just... sad and uninteresting, ofcourse some people will defend this so i guess those people are enough to buy all your copies

I'm agree with darky and completely have nothing to add. Had same story with my friends (not with beta game, but with trailer), they said that naked girls and farting zombies are really cheap trash... I'm not agree with them, cause I see a potential of this project, but I can't see it succeeds with that kind of "soul"...

schalalalalala...

So that`s all? Project finally cancelled because of being rejected by Steam? A bit strange to me after years (?) of work.