Originally Posted By: Dan Silverman

But those that end up in eternal bliss (heaven) will be without any influence of sin/evil whatsoever. As such, would not existence there then be pointless as well (according to your logic)?


Not really. Once paradise is achieved, the person going there can look back and feel really good about him/herself, knowing that they could have entered Hell instead. So it is because of our choices, i.e. exercising our free will, that we were able to end up there. That's what I meant when I said that Heaven and Hell are the point of creation (at least for us).

God could have created Heaven and put everyone in there, and everyone would have been happy... or would they? According to Islamic teaching, this is exactly what happened...

"Lo! We offered the trust unto the heavens and the earth and the hills, but they shrank from bearing it and were afraid of it. And man assumed it. Lo! he hath proved a tyrant and a fool." (Quran 33:72)

Humans took upon themselves the responsibility of having free will (the trust), where the rest of creation refused. It was our choice which got us here to begin with.

Regarding your second point, the following line seems to sum it up:
Originally Posted By: Dan Silverman

However, a man that lives a decent life ... never actually commits those crimes ... but never accepts Christ ... he gets to spend eternity in hell.


This is a big problem with Christian doctrine, and one of the reasons I do not accept it. The Quran is very different on this matter, please read the following verses.

"Then lo! thy Lord for those who do evil in ignorance and afterward repent and amend--lo! (for them) thy Lord is afterward indeed Forgiving, Merciful." (Quran 16:119)

"Forgiveness is only incumbent on Allah toward those who do evil in ignorance (and) then turn quickly (in repentance) to Allah. These are they toward whom Allah relenteth. Allah is ever Knower, Wise. The forgiveness is not for those who do ill deeds until, when death attendeth upon one of them, he saith: Lo! I repent now; nor yet for those who die while they are disbelievers. For such We have prepared a painful doom." (Quran 4:17-18)

"Whosoever goeth right, it is only for (the good of) his own soul that he goeth right, and whosoever erreth, erreth only to its hurt. No laden soul can bear another's load. We never punish until We have sent a messenger." (Quran 17:15)

"Lo! those who believe (in that which is revealed unto thee, Muhammad), and those who are Jews, and Christians, and Sabaeans whoever believeth in Allah and the Last Day and doeth right surely their reward is with their Lord, and there shall no fear come upon them neither shall they grieve." (Quran 2:62)

If you take all these verses into consideration, it becomes clear that God does not punish someone who is truly ignorant of his crime. This may imply two things for your man in the jungle. First, if he was truly ignorant of God (Allah), and never even thought about his accountability before Him, then of course God (Allah) would not punish him. Alternatively, it may imply that everyone on earth will be exposed to enough truth so as to be fit for judgement. I actually prefer implication #1, because there are sayings of Prophet Muhammad which further illustrate this point. One is that a child will not be held accountable until he reaches puberty, a madman will not be held accountable until he regains his sanity, and a sleeping person will not be held accountable until he wakes up.

To reiterate, a person can only be judged according to what they were aware, not according to what some guy with a big hat says (i.e religious authority), and only God knows what is within each and every heart. With that said, we were all given a conscience, and the basic ideas of right and wrong are innate within each person. So if someone never learned one bit about God, he still would be judged according to his conscience.

Finally, in effect you are judging God, based on whatyou imagine Heaven and Hell to be like. Since neither you nor I have been there, this is not a sound argument. I want to re-enforce my point again, that if we accept that there is a Hell, we cannot blame God (Allah) for the people being punished therein, because God (Allah) also explains the following:

"And if a breath of thy Lord's punishment were to touch them, they assuredly would say: Alas for us! Lo!
we were wrong-doers." (Quran 21:46)


"Lo! Allah wrongeth not mankind in aught; but mankind wrong themselves."(Quran 10:44)

So if we accept that there is a Hell, and we want to base an argument from it, we must also accept that it is a just and balanced Hell. Whether we can understand the justice of it now is irrelevant. As a side point, Heaven and Hell are not a black and white thing in Islam. There are degrees of reward, and degrees of punishment.

"There are degrees (of grace and reprobation) with Allah, and Allah is Seer of what ye do." (Quran 3:163)

I hope this makes my position more clear.

For everyone else:
I think this is still (however remotely) linked to teaching creationism (or intelligent design) in schools, because I am defending the idea that not all monotheistic religions are illogical or unscientific.