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1)Are you proposing that the electrons are always colliding with virtual particles?

2)You also believe that these particles are not matter at all? But that these particles are something which we don't understand? Well if they are not matter, and if they are something which we don't understand than they are super-natural? They are magic particles?



First of all I dont dare to propose anything, here we are at the limits of human knowledge
I just try to report what the " state of art " of modern physics is

The term " matter " by itself is not a scientific term
How can you measure the quantiy of matter ?
You can measure mass, energy, speed etc but not matter

However if for matter you mean the ordinary matter ( rocks, wood, meat etc ) it is evident that the virtual particles are not matter
Ordinary matter is made of protons, neutrons and electrons, only

You know for sure that in particle accelerator and in cosmic radiations you can find a lot of particles which are not ordinary " matter " as well
Would you define them " super natural " or " magic " particles
I dont think so

The same for virtual particles
The term " virtual " can be deceiving
They are " real" particles
They are called " virtual " due to the fact that you can not detect them because of their short life span but their existance is proved by their effects, for example the collision with the electrons


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Where do the magic particles come from?


I am sure you got the point even though you may be disappointed

The virtual particles have not been discovered
If so , you can reasonably ask the question:

where do they come from ?

The existance of the virtual particles has been predicted
not only, according to the theory, supported by evidence, they must exist everywhere and every time
This make a huge difference
It may entail that the " existance " is a normal rather than an exceptional status
In other words a creator is not strictly needed , unless you assume that a super natural creator is himself subjected to the physical laws
When God created the universe He was obliged , because of the Heisemebrg's principle, to make a thin plate vibrate in the deep space
A little be strange , dont you agree ?

Is it a non intuitive claim ?
Of course it is not, but common sense has been banned from modern physics since a long time


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But there is one major error in your posts. You keep talking about math based upon fundamental postulates, but those fundamental postulates are all based upon common sense and intuition


This is the subtle distinction that I tried to explain
Phylosophers have been telling a lot of nonsense for thousand years because they keep making a major error

They get started from " intuitive " assumptions rather than from the hard facts
They wrapp such banalities with esoteric expressions and more or less methaphisical speculations and they come to usless conclusions

The euclidian geometry which student are taught at school is also based on initial intuitive axioms but there is a big difference
Mathematician are aware of the domain of validity of their speculation

Last edited by AlbertoT; 01/05/09 14:21.