I agree Grimber, the only real way to get anywhere is to stop treating science and religion as two totally polar perspectives and try to marry the truth within religious reference, with our scientific knowledge. Because both knowledge bases ARE incomplete.. our answer will still be limited, but it will be a more kosher approach than any side has taken so far.

:| Now you're talkin Nitro.

Same thing with the existence or non existence of God. The sooner all sides, religions, and areligions are ready to admit that they dunno any better than any other side that they DONT know the absolute truth..the better off we'll be.

:| To me, what needs to be done is not one side convincing every other side of its viewpoint.. cuz that's never going to happen..what we need to agree upon is a general.. central agreement for all intents and purposes. The conflict and disagreement

To me, in the real world, we dont need to know what created us, what created it, and so on. What we should be digging toward is where we're going..instead of where we came from. in a sense where we come from is a big part of where we're going, but we have yet to approach that question nonpartisanly..and as a result we're no closer to answering where we came from then we were 10,20,200, 2000 years ago.. it's too big a question.

So what we should evaluate is.. what is our condition now.. and what do we do to thrive for the next few millenia.

All truth will reveal itself in time. We just have to be more patient than we have been.. cuz it's not going to come to us right away.